Just some advice please

I have a lovely white staffie called Hollie who is a rescue so i have no history. The first walk we had down our local park she went for another dog and held on and wouldnt let go, no blood was brought

Yesterday my 28 yr old stepson took her for a walk along what we call the old railway track where he met a friend of his and her dog both dogs were fine wagging tails no growling nothing and Hollie went for the other dog and drew blood. He has now said he wont walk her again and my daughter (13) is reluctant to as well. I tend to walk her where there are no other dogs and i am constantly on my guard with her when she sees other dogs i just keep walking.

I am due to have surgery on my back soon which means she wont be walked as much if at all while i recover. I said to my OH what shall we do ? Do i take her back im feeling so torn like im giving up on her. The plan was to rescue another so she would have a friend but i doubt that will happen now.

She has also started weeing and pooing overnight and the past 2 days has been very loose

Do these muzzles really work ? Is this really the answer ?

Hiya! Sorry to hear you're having problems, did the rescue centre test her around other dogs before you adopted her? If they're a decent rescue yo should be able to contact them to gain some further advice from an on site behaviourist if they have one.

Some staffords just don't like other dogs, and due to their size and strength you can't risk her grabbing hold of another dog. Personally, I think muzzling would be the way forward for this girl, at least then you could safely spend some time getting to know her behaviour around other dogs, and concentrate on observing her body language to try and figure out what is going through her head before an "attack." I wouldn't be allowing your 13 year old daughter to walk her, dog fights can be very scary and it can take a lot of confidence and strength to split them up if they escalate. You would need to train her positively to wear the muzzle though, I would suggest a baskerville ultra for comfort and safety. Do you let her off lead at the moment?

The accidents over night may just be an upset tummy, or picking up on your stress from the incidents? What is she fed on and what times is she fed?

Are you able to keep her on the lead during walks with whoever is doing the walking ? Maybe try a long training lead instead of letting her off the lead completely.

What kind of set up is the rescue centre you got her from, would they be able to help with any behavioural issues if you got in contact with them again ?

Would you be able to get a dog walker in for the time you are recooperating from your back surgery ?

As for the pooing in the home try going back to basics with the toilet training, take her out after a sleep, after play and after feeding, the loose poo may be down to her food, what is she fed ?

I think you have to keep her on the lead for the mean time at least and make any introductions to other dogs while they are both on the lead and under control. If it's any consolation we have had very similar issues with Rocky but we are getting there now (we have had him for 3 years).

Hi Thanks for your replies

I have not taken her off lead at all since i have had her since she is partially deaf, we were told by the Home that she had hearing problems no issue there as our previous dog was also deaf. I have both an extendable lead and a standard lead im not sure which one was used yesterday as i was at work at the time. I prefer her on a shorter lead as she tends (as most staffies do) to really pull me about to begin with. The other dog was on a lead to thats what shocked me as well. Ive had many owners let there dogs wonder off and ive had to shout to them to get them on a lead or we have turned round and gone back .
I have considered the yellow coats that have been advertised to warn owners to keep their distance think they are called "I need space"

Food well i have been trying her on a new brand over the past few weeks and she has seemed fine so i made the decision to do the complete change this week so i have a feeling its to do with that plus she was given a treat of jumbone quite late on Tuesday i tend to give her a biscuit and leave her in the kitchen where she has always stayed overnight since she came home in November. She is fed twice a day around 7.30am and 5pm and wet and dry mix.

@Kathy where can you get those muzzles from ? I have a safety muzzle from a previous dog which was never used is that the same thing ?

Sorry I didn't say anything about the muzzle but this is the one Rachel mentioned. This link gives you a size guide, then just do a search online for a good price either Amazon or Pets At Home will have them, :

http://www.companyofanimals.co.uk/products/baskerville-muzzles/baskerville-ultra-muzzle

Ella has done a very guide to Muzzle training your dog in the link below:

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t42623-muzzle-training-a-dog

Sorry Kathy x Thanks for the links x

@Rachel33
No they didnt say anything about her not socialising with other dogs and when i called they said you can never really tell until you take them home, yes its a well known Home

Gadget Girl wrote: I prefer her on a shorter lead as she tends (as most staffies do) to really pull me about to begin with. The other dog was on a lead to thats what shocked me as well. Ive had many owners let there dogs wonder off and ive had to shout to them to get them on a lead or we have turned round and gone back .
I have considered the yellow coats that have been advertised to warn owners to keep their distance think they are called "I need space"

When some dogs are on the lead they can see this as being trapped, maybe the leads got in a tangle when the dogs met which caused a misunderstanding and stress about being enclosed.

This has happend when I have been walking Rocky before when meeting a dog he knows quite well, he got stressed when tangled up in another dogs lead. Rocky is always walked on a lead either short or extender.

The coloured leads and jackets are a good idea so long as other dog walkers know what they mean too.

Just thought i would update on this, the owners of the dog have been in touch today and state they had to take their dog to the vet the bites that Hollie inflicted were worse than what was originally thought and the poor has had to have his neck stapled, various injections and a course of antibiotics and a bill of £150. The owner was concerned that she could turn at any time so we invited her round to meet Hollie so she could see what she is like in the home. I think she quite surprised that such a loving dog could do what she did. She didnt want us to give her anything for the bill and she informed us she hadnt called the police. But this matter has really stressed me out so much today that i have made a decision to possibly return her back to the home. Im not even sure i can take her back of not but i have contacted them to ask for some advice. I just wanted to fill you in on this sad day x

Hiya! Thanks for updating us, how awful Feel so much for you and her, but it has to be right, and dog aggression can be hard to handle. Hope you're okay as can be! Perhaps after you've recovered from your surgery you could consider taking in another that is more suited to your family. Please don't let this put you off rescuing another stafford at some point, there are thousands upon thousands out there looking for homes, though this little lady may be a little too much for you, i'm sure you'll come across another that fits right in. Best wishes xx

Rachel33 wrote:Hiya! Thanks for updating us, how awful :(Feel so much for you and her, but it has to be right, and dog aggression can be hard to handle. Hope you're okay as can be! Perhaps after you've recovered from your surgery you could consider taking in another that is more suited to your family. Please don't let this put you off rescuing another stafford at some point, there are thousands upon thousands out there looking for homes, though this little lady may be a little too much for you, i'm sure you'll come across another that fits right in. Best wishes xx

Brilliantly Said Rachel.

Good luck whatever you decide.

Thank you Rachel33 for your kind words

The home will take her back however she did say they would not be able to rehome her they would put her to sleep

Talk about pull on your heartstrings its like giving her a deathwish can i live with knowing thats what would happen im really stuck can anyone please help me

What?! Excuse my french, but that is bullsh*t! How dare they put that onto you!! Clearly what has happened has shaken you up, and if you don't feel that you can't cope with this behaviour then you can't feel guilty it's not your fault! I've currently got a foster boy with me who was supposed to be an adoption, but due to his behaviours I can't safely exercise him and Biscuit together. I felt horrendous saying I wouldn't be able to keep him, but I knew it was the right decision in my heart.

Where abouts are you based? If you decide that you would like to keep her I could get some advice and possibly a training plan for you from a behaviourist that I work with here in Devon, and of course there would be ongoing support for you from all of the wonderful people on this forum, there is always somebody about to help. But at the same time, if this is going to be too much and you don't feel that you would be equipped to keep her and other dogs safe, then you need to do the sensible thing for you.

My goodness that does sound very unfair of the rescue centre to do that to you, please consider Rachel's very kind offer and see what she can do for you ? There are many training tecniques out there and I'm sure you would find something that works for you both.

Thank you both so much for your kind words, since i rang them this afternoon ive been so upset cannot believe that they could say that , I know that there are hundreds of dogs needing homes we could have had anyone of them but they have failed to give us a real account of what she is like i dont even think they have let her meet other dogs.
@Rachel33
I live in a village in Staffordshire on the border of Wolverhampton, Im going to talk it over with the rest of the family when they come home tonight. I am so grateful i have found some support here and if you were closer i would give you a big hug. Can you still help me from such a distance ?

It's extremely unfair of them! It's very much their mistake, you were re-homed a dog that you didn't know you were taking in. I've sent an email so waiting for a reply now, but yes can still help from afar, as long as you can give a clear account of her behaviour as it can be hard to decipher sometimes if you can't see it. I was a first time dog owner when I took in little Biscuit who is aggressive towards men and other dogs, you CAN do it! I've laughed, cried and screamed all at once, more than once, in the last 2 years of living with her, but I wouldn't have it any other way. As long as you're prepared to make some adjustments to your current lives, talk it through with your family, and as long as you're all happy we will all help as much as we can. But at the same time if you decide that it isn't right for you all, none of us are going to judge you. x

@Rachel33 thank you again, are you aware she is about 80% deaf another thing they didnt confirm either ! They said some hearing problems but nothing like the way she is.

Would you be able to get some video footage of her at various times during the day ?, maybe when you are out with her during a walk so Rachel can see how she behaves around other dogs and with people. I'm sure this will help the process Rachel ?

She has absolutely no issues with any human whatsoever she will jump up whoever visits and flop by the side of you the same on walks. I can see no trigger point from her at all.

as soon as she sees another dog she will stop and look intently at it if it comes near she will take an interest only if that dog does come towards she doesnt growl until she pounces by which time its usually too late. If im walking her i tell other owners to keep their dogs away

I will get some video footage as well. I have also been doing some research on a local rescue that could help me as well so fingers crossedx

http://www.devondogbehaviour.co.uk/ this is Ruth's website lovely, she's said to give her call and she will help as much as she can from afar. Her number is on the website. xx

So sorry to hear that Hollie is causing you grief & heartache.

I'm not sure I can offer much in the way of advice but can share my experiences with a deaf Staffy. We got her as a rescue also and didn't know too much about her background too. Even though she is 99%.deaf she can hear some things.

At first we kept her on a short lead as from previous experience of owning a staff know how they can react to other dogs on occasion. We found that she pulled a lot so decided to get a 10 meter lead to give her more freedom. The difference was almost immediate, no more pulling!

What we found was that once she learnt to trust us she was fine. Being on a short lead meant that she could feel us tense as other dogs approached and she became defensive. Off the lead she is much more relaxed and will walk past other dogs without a second glance most of the time.

There are times though where even at 50 paces away, her hair goes up and she is ready to rumble. She never actually bites, more teeth and noise really but still scary to those that don't know her.

I'm not advocating you do any of the above, however, perhaps you could try relaxing on the lead over time and see if Hollie mellows as my Dawg did.

I wish you all the best.

I would try her with a baskerville ultra muzzle. I have used one successfully with Lola. You could keep her away from other dogs when out walking as not to stress her. A muzzle would give you peace of mind when out with her   

Hi folks thanks so much for your advice and support today its been extremely stressful and upsetting. After speaking with hubby and the kids we all agreed that under no circumstances would she go anywhere if she was to be pts. I am still awaiting a call from the local rescue as I do think that is probably best for her and us, however I will wait till the right home comes for her. I have ordered the muzzle this evening as was suggested by a few of you thanks again for that.

Hollie hasnt been the same since last Wednesday she has been off and on her food she seems unsettled and bothered by something. My eldest was messing about with one of the replica swords he pointed it towards me and Hollie growled she has never growled in the home before im beginning to wonder whether something happened to her previous owner dont you think that strange I know I will never know her history but maybe we can piece together some of whats happened to her in the past.
thanks again all xxx
Michelle x

Hollie probably had a fright herself about the other dog and will be fragile. Glad you are getting the muzzle, it will give you peace of mind. There is a training video on youtube of how to introduce her to it.

Hi folks, I have had a call from the Home where i had Hollie from and quite a long talk with the Manager of the home on the best course of action. She really advises i return her to them, i explained i really dont want her pts however she said she would be assessed but the likelihood is that they would not recommend her being rehomed to anyone. The chances of her doing it again to another dog or even person really does seem quite high. The family want to try with the muzzle and im 50/50 as i know i dont relax when i take her out or even when someone else does. I know im going to be overuled at home and i feel terrible for even considering it. Im still mulling over all the advice given here and i have looked at the link that was sent me and im reading up on other advice to. I just want to thank you all xx

Hollie won't be able to bite with the muzzle on. Make sure it is the black baskerville ultra you get. If you always keep her on the lead

Ruth has welcomed your call lovely, even just for some general advice and to talk through with a professional if you feel that you would be able to handle this! She has so much experience with bull breeds in worked in rescue for 25 years! xx

I would have a chat with Rachel's lady definitely if you can, any help and advice could make all the difference to your decision.

If a muzzle will help you all relax with her while out, it may be the solution?
x

I'm annoyed with this rescue. They have behaved totally irresponsibly.

They have not assessed the dog's needs and as a result have put it in more danger of hurting itself / someone else / being put down.

I can't imagine how stressful all this must have been for you.

"You can never really tell until you take them home" is total b.s.

This is a serious issue which is their responsibility and they have failed to address. If there is any doubt about a dog's aggression/anxiety they should not be rehomed to a family with children. And certainly not to anyone who is not made fully aware of the dog's problems.

Poor you and poor little Hollie.

Please send an update.

I am absolutely stunned at the behaviour of the rescue centre. They are prepared to LET YOU take all the risks here with your family etc. without giving you all the info they seem to have about the dog.

Then, when you realise that there are issues, they put the potential guilt of Hollie being pts back on YOU also.

The outside behaviour towards dogs is possibly tolerable/controllable/improvable however, if Hollie starts showing aggressive behaviour towards your family I would be very careful.

You would be unlikely to muzzle in the home and if the worst did happen God forbid, then the same pts outcome would result but with a possible injury to  member of your family thrown in.

You are obviously a very caring and dedicated person but, as bad as you may feel for the Dog, imagine how you would feel if there was an incident with one of your kids.

Nobody wants any dog pts (still can't believe the Rescue centre said that) but if she starts getting Human aggressive around the House, be careful.

Keep a close eye on her behaviour around the House.

Hi folks

I thought i would log on to give you all an update

After taking on all the advice that was given for I called Ruth and we had a long chat where she really did give me some good advice over the phone which we took.

However that same evening after the chat with the family something changed in Hollie, my son is 16 and suffers from ASD he came up behind me and hugged me which he always does, Hollie growled and when to lurch at him my husband managed to grab her collar and stop her. She calmed down as if nothing happened however is scared me so much i knew i had to return her but on my terms.

The Home agreed and she was returned to another branch who said they would assess her and put her into training they asked if id like any updates about her and i said no because if i know she was PTS it would destroy me. Please understand i did NOT have any choice mine and my families safety is more important than anything and though i do realise what the outcome maybe i know we are safe. It broke my heart as i have never given up on animals no matter what they are. I used to take in Guinea pigs no one wanted some were "supposedly" vicious but with the right care and patience I turned them round.

I also dont know if i have mentioned this previously but my husband ran a Husky rescue with his ex wife a few years ago. About a week ago we had a call from someone who my hubby works with asking if we were still taking in rescues as her Nephew had passed away and his wife couldnt cope with a husky as well as 5 pommies ! We went to see her she is 18 months old and a pure bred White Husky called Bliz (short for Blizard) she has settled in really well and i do beleive that fate sometimes happens and things happen for a reason.

I know some may think this was too soon but she has helped the heartache.

Id personally like to thank you for all of your advice and if you dont mind would still like to stay a member and pop in from time to time.

Cheers

Michelle

Heartbreaking as this is, I believe you have done the right thing by your family.

Hopefully the Rescue centre will behave more responsibly next time and pass on to any potential owners ALL the information on the dog.

I fear I may sound hard hearted, but it is just that I believe that in the long term, one of your family, and possibly another family in the future (if the recue centre do not amend their apparent philosophy of re-home at any cost) even worse heartache with potentially the same eventual outcome for the dog.
I hope you can take a small crumb of comfort from this. You obviously tried your best.

Good Luck.

Really sorry to hear that, can imagine that it was heartbreaking for you. I truly believe that you have done the right thing, but I'm glad that Ruth could have been of some help, was with her last weekend and she asked about the situation. Best wishes with your new addition, hope she's better suited to your family. xx

@Tonyw thank you for your kind words x
@Rachel33 Ruth was fantastic and all would have been ok if that incident did not occur, please send on my best wishes x and thank you Rachel33 you have been a real help to me xx

Thanks for the update, I'm sorry it didn't work out with Hollie but best of luck with Bliz x

I think you've been amazing. There are more and more HUskies in rescue now, and - frankly - rescuing any animal is amazing.

As for rehabilitating guinea pigs... I had no idea they were trainable. My friend has just got two for her son - let me know any tips/ground rules.

I would love to know how you get on with your Husky and what the breed is like as a pet. There is a guy in our local park who has one who says he has to walk his dog five hours a day. This sounds excessive but who knows...

Have passed them on. Glad we could help! Feel free to stick around and maybe post in our other pets and animals section? Best wishes lovely xx

Rupertsbooks wrote:I think you've been amazing. There are more and more HUskies in rescue now, and - frankly - rescuing any animal is amazing.

As for rehabilitating guinea pigs... I had no idea they were trainable. My friend has just got two for her son - let me know any tips/ground rules.

I would love to know how you get on with your Husky and what the breed is like as a pet. There is a guy in our local park who has one who says he has to walk his dog five hours a day. This sounds excessive but who knows...

Thank you Rupert , Yes Guinea Pigs can be but you have to be patient and handle every day and they are rewarding

I will post some pics on the Other Pets page as requested x

Thank you to everyone on here for your support x