Stud Dogs

Our blue female is only 9 months at the minute but when she is old enough we are wanting to breed her but we're not wanting to breed her with just any old dog. We're wanting to strengthen her pedigree and her colour so we're looking for either Black or Blue with Champions preferably in the first 3 lines. We have our eye on some that weve seen but i just wondering if anybody had any suggestions. Thankyou

Don't go for Blue, it won't strengthen her colour, it'll weaken it as blue is a dilute of black. Go for a black or brindle.

Don't forget to wait until your girl is at least 2 years old, and get her fully health tested for hereditable problems - make sure the stud dog is also fully health tested.

Totally agree with Caryll make sure she has all the relevant health checks beforehand

Caryll beat me to it! That's exactly what I was going to say! Good luck in your search!

Also please remember to plan way ahead. If your bitch doesn't accept her litter? if there are health problems with your bitch preventing her from caring for her litter, finding homes and securing homes and relevent house/people tests before selling her pups, making sure the pups are old enough physically and mentally developed enough to be taking away from their mother.

All excellent advice so far so nothing else to add but good luck

agree with caryll need to go for a good black, my blue is turning brindle because it was bred from blue and blue, but saw a lovely blue the other month who was about 2 years and he was bred from blue/black

Also take her along to a SBT show and ask some experienced showers or preferabley some judges to look over her once she is mature around 2 years. They will give u a honest answer as 2 wether or not she is good enough to breed from. I dont mean to offend but there are hell of alot of really bad examples of kc reg staffs around espeacially blues and u dont want to add 2 that problem by breeding from a poor example. Also if the reason u want 2 breed her is that u want her 2 just have 1 litter or want to see what her pups will be like or reasons like that its not really a reason 2 breed at the moment with so many staffs ending up in rescue and pounds and then being killed even kc reg ones! If u want to better the breed it will be very hard work (if ur bitch has proven to be of good standard) to find a complementry stud dog, there is a lot more to think about than if its black or blue. Whatever your decision good luck

lynne wrote:agree with caryll need to go for a good black, my blue is turning brindle because it was bred from blue and blue, but saw a lovely blue the other month who was about 2 years and he was bred from blue/black

Its amazing the difference it makes to the strength of the colour isnt it. The best ones are always the suprises from a black and black mating! x

Agree with Carly, nicely put x

blaze wrote:Also take her along to a SBT show and ask some experienced showers or preferabley some judges to look over her once she is mature around 2 years. They will give u a honest answer as 2 wether or not she is good enough to breed from. I dont mean to offend but there are hell of alot of really bad examples of kc reg staffs around espeacially blues and u dont want to add 2 that problem by breeding from a poor example. Also if the reason u want 2 breed her is that u want her 2 just have 1 litter or want to see what her pups will be like or reasons like that its not really a reason 2 breed at the moment with so many staffs ending up in rescue and pounds and then being killed even kc reg ones! If u want to better the breed it will be very hard work (if ur bitch has proven to be of good standard) to find a complementry stud dog, there is a lot more to think about than if its black or blue. Whatever your decision good luck

Excellent advice.

Unfortunatly my advise would be dont, I am sorry.

Unless you have a bitch who is show winning standard and you know what your doing.

But to answer your question black with dilute gene of course would be your best option, to make good quality blue litter from what I know. Again make sure this dog is of show standard with alot of champions in pedigree. Make sure both dogs have been health tested, make sure you know the risks involved in breeding and are prepared for this.

What makes you want to breed? Is your bitch of a very high standard? Has she been to shows and done well?

I love blues and got 2 myself but would never consider breeding, our bitch was spayed 3 months after her first season for this reason. I would not be able to go through the heart ache of loosing her through complications or loosing a whole litter through complications, she is our pet not a show dog worth breeding from.

Are you prepared to take back any pups who their new owner buys and then decides they carnt handle a dog and want to get rid? Are you prepared to keep any pups you carnt sell? It happens.

Far to many people decide its a good idea to breed their dog without good reason and far too many poor quality and poor heath dogs are a result of this. Also if you realised just how many dogs are in the rescue centers at the moment due to poor breeding practises you might think twice.

Hey.

Thankyou for all the good advice. Dont think im going into this blind as this isnt my first time breeding.
I bred english springer spaniels for nearly ten years and still own my stud dog. My dogs were kc registered, had had all the neccessary tests done like for pra etc, had been to some amatuer shows and had done alright but were primarily working dogs who a family friend trained and took on shoots and i decided to breed them because they were exceptionally good at thier job and it proved worth while as most of my pups have gone on to working homes and done exceptionally well too and most still keep in touch, even having pups themselves and producing excellent workers.
I was always fully prepared to have no sleep and for the consequences if she rejected them for example.
I always offered the people that took them the opportunity to fetch any back that they didnt want anymore and proved it by taking a male back when he was a year old when the children of the family developed an allergy. I dont just let pups go to just any old homes to make a quick buck, i sit down and talk with them and make sure they knew the breed and could give the pups what they required and have turned quite a few down who i thought just wanted a puppy till the fun wore off.

My staffies will have all the correct testing done too and i will be the same with their pups as i was with the springers.
Im fully aware of the health concerns etc with the staffy not just from owning them but from knowing people who show and breed staffies and have done for years. It was actually a couple of these people who suggested i breed from my bitch as they say she is a good example of the breed. When i was searching for a female blue puppy, i didnt just get the nearest and cheapest pup to me, i searched all over the place and found an excellent breeder whose dogs were all health tested and who lived just a couple of hours away from me. The reason im searching for a stud dog when i have a kc registered dog of my own is because he is taller than the kennel club regulations and i didnt wanna pass this on to my pups as i wanted the best quality pups i could get which is why im trying to find a dog to strenghten her lines

Ahright good, obvious choices are Valgo or Crossguns. If you contact them to see if they have any studs that meet your requirements.

http://www.crossguns.com

This is a good site for getting contacts of a high quality too. Also going to shows obviously is a better way.

http://www.champdogs.co.uk/breeds/staffordshire-bull-terrier/stud-dogs

indigostaffs wrote:The reason im searching for a stud dog when i have a kc registered dog of my own is because he is taller than the kennel club regulations and i didnt wanna pass this on to my pups as i wanted the best quality pups i could get which is why im trying to find a dog to strenghten her lines

This made me sooo happy to read! WAY too many are breeding tall, or "long legged" Staffords and it drives me up a wall. Glad to hear you have done your homework!

The two dogs i actually had my eye on were both valgo. One blue and one black brindle. both with excellent pedigrees. thinking the black brindle is the best one to use for strengthening the lines. The thing we had is that we didnt want too many if any at all names to cross in the pedigree and after checking out their pedigrees i dont think there is any. The both have champions in first 3 lines too which is good

Personally I have no problem with the same dog appearing more than once in a pedigree as long as it's not too often & there are no close matings. I know others disagree with me on that.

Sometimes, to get the right complimentary stud for your bitch you have to go for one that has one or two names that appear more than once.

To be honest, though, I wouldn't even be considering which stud to use until your girl's at least 18 months old - and even then, you'll have another 6 months to wait, but at least you can book his services! At this early stage any stud you're looking at may have been removed from stud by the time your girl is ready!

everybody is breeding blues the market is fflooded with them just look on epupz or k9 and 90% of the pups are blue thats why i went for a pied one to go with billy

We are getting a pied female soon. Your pied puppy is absolutely gorgeous bytheway

I assume the Blue is Valgo Singing the Blues?

The Black brindle, wont that mean the litter is likely to all brindle, even if they are Blue brindle, unfortunaly they are quite undesirable to most buyers of blue dogs. Often the case is people want solid blue or a little white.

Dont hold me to that, I know nothing about breeding except what I have read from here and other internet sources.

But if thats true personally I would want to find a high quality solid black, with blue gene, as far as I know both dogs need the blue gene to make a blue litter.

If colour is not an issue for you then obviously that dont matter but going off what you said in your first post about wanting to strengthen her pedigree and her colour. I assume colour is important to you.

The blue you talk about as far as I know when breeding 2 blues your very likely to have a much lighter blue each time and also increase risk of health issues as blues are more likely to suffer from skin issues.

We know this from first hand Molly has skin issues, although we get by and it dont effect her to bad its not nice for her.

I get what your saying about it being early to search but we just wanted to know we were finding the right dog. Its just the way we like to do it. We have been speaking to breeders about their dogs with them fully understanding it will be ages. I get what your saying about same names in the pedigree as ive heard arguments for both sides of that argument

indigostaffs wrote:I get what your saying about it being early to search but we just wanted to know we were finding the right dog. Its just the way we like to do it. We have been speaking to breeders about their dogs with them fully understanding it will be ages. I get what your saying about same names in the pedigree as ive heard arguments for both sides of that argument

I too would not worry about same name in pedigree to a certian extent, its very common practise for high quality show dogs to have same names apper in 4th 5th generation, aslong as its not to much and is not in the lower generations I dont see an issue personaly.

yeah it is and the other one is tactician. We were thinking about the brindle in the black one and are still trying to find a solid black one which is why i asked if anybody knew any. We keep coming up against obstacles as its either the colour that isnt quite right or the pedigree that isnt strong enough.
I'm sure we will get the perfect one eventualy and we kow it wont be easy but nothing worth doing ever is

Its just like when i bred springers. It took me ages to find the right stud with the right amount of colour and a good pedigree to compliment my bitch

www.stamtavler.com/dogarchive/details.php?id=20423

http://www.champdogs.co.uk/breeds/staffordshire-bull-terrier/stud-dogs#23340

http://www.champdogs.co.uk/breeds/staffordshire-bull-terrier/stud-dogs?start=20#22185

http://www.champdogs.co.uk/breeds/staffordshire-bull-terrier/stud-dogs?start=20#23590

Dont know if got blue gene at all though but they are about, also dont know anything about them or specific traits your looking for or anything but just a few examples I found on that champ dogs with a very quick look.

As already mentioned may well be worth waiting a short while yet before looking incase by the time you want to go ahead they have stopped using the dog as a stud. Although I am sure you plan on getting many options together so you will always have fall back options, an options that arise over your period of looking around.

billy and kya wrote:www.stamtavler.com/dogarchive/details.php?id=20423

Nice, also shows its not always about having champs in lower gens of pedigree too.

Caryll wrote:Personally I have no problem with the same dog appearing more than once in a pedigree as long as it's not too often & there are no close matings. I know others disagree with me on that.

Sometimes, to get the right complimentary stud for your bitch you have to go for one that has one or two names that appear more than once.

Close line breeding is just about on the same level as inbreeding and KC breeders should stop doing it. IMO with so many staffys around to day if breeders cant find another staffy to compliment your dog then they shouldn't be breeding at all.

I thought you were meant to breed for conformation, not colour?

shakespearesdog wrote:I thought you were meant to breed for conformation, not colour?

Surely it should be possiable to do both?

Although if you truely want the very very best I would expect colour should not come into the selection process.

I don't mean to come across rude but why do you want to breed blues? It seems all breeders at the moment are breeding the blue colour and its very hard to find any other shade. I don't dislike the shade, i'm just curious as to why its suddenly so popular.

shakespearesdog wrote:I thought you were meant to breed for conformation, not colour?

I agree, health and conformation should always come first.

the colour as to be part of any type of breeding or all dog would be the same colour.