Recall and snapping help please

Hi all,

I'm in desperate need of some advice. Tilly is now 15 months old and her recall has gone ... Completely. Everything is more interesting than us :-( we're trying everything - squeakers, running the other way, high voices, low voices you name it we've tried it. I hate the thought of keeping her on a lead all the time but am finding the lack of recall stressful especially as this morning it caused an almighty row with some other dog (staffy) owners, which leads me onto my next problem ...

When Tilly greets other dogs who are on leads she goes into pounce position and then snaps away like a crocodile. If the other dog pounces back and wants to play she runs off and then plays, however if they retreat or growl/show any other 'go away' signals she keeps snapping.

So this morning not only did she ignore my recall, she approached another dog who was on the lead and who growled at her, leading Tilly to go all pouncy and start snapping. The owners whacked Tilly away and went mental, even though I was trying to recall her and making my way to get hold of her.

This is really stressing me out as she is not aggressive at all.

Any ideas on how to stop her doing the snapping and start coming to call?

Sounds a little like she's pushing a little, I'd go right back to basics with her, I wouldn't let Darcy approach an on lead dog especially with out permission, but Darcy has gone through this and we now use a long line while we're working on her recall. Have you thought of using one? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/360498978300?lpid=83&device=t&adtype=pla&crdt=0&ff3=1&ff11=ICEP3.0.0&ff12=67&ff13=80&ff14=83&ff19=0

Yep, tried the long line but we got into a right muddle. She walks nicely on an extension lead but where we go we very often only see one or two dogs as its very remote and most of them play nicely together.

I get the feeling she's just going to have to be on her lead permanently which makes me sad :-(

Just go back to basics and teach her like you did when she was first learning she'll get it again

Remove her total freedom by using a 15 metre fabric line.
That way, there's a boundary and safety zone you can work with.

Biscuit is always on a long line as she is fear aggressive and it would be very irresponsible for me to let her completely free, but although it takes a while to get used to (I still get tangled up!!) it's a fantastic tool and well worth using. I use a 50ft police training line, and let go of it, always being close enough to grab the end if needs be, which helps to stop it getting tangled so much. It is general etiquette not to let your off lead dog approach an on lead dog, they are on lead for a reason and could end up with Tilly getting attacked! Sorry to say but you are being a little irresponsible.. Teaching her to approach dogs politely, an training impulse control and general obedience around other dogs would be much more appropriate.

Whilst I take the irresponsible comment on the chin I will just clarify that I was in a designated off lead area at the park and these people appeared through woods with their dog originally off the lead. Tilly offers herself to play in this way whether she is on or off her lead and I need actual ideas of how to train her as I know she needs further obedience training regarding this.

As for etiquette, I agree and am 95% successful
At getting her back on the lead when I see a dog approaching but want to be as near to 100% as possible. I will add that a stunning amount of dog owners don't even make an attempt to recall their dogs and at least I am trying to get it right.

Yes, you're trying to get it right, and I for one applaud you for it!

What I would do in your position is try again with the long line (a 50' one is ideal), but just let it trail, keeping the end alwqays within reach. That way she (and you!) will be far less likely to get tangled up in it! If she doesn't come the minute you call, you can just reel her in - you should, of course, only have the long line attached to a harness to avoid any neck injuries.

In the meantime, have you tried teaching the 'watch' command?

Okay, I'll be honest I never exercise my dogs in dog parks, so don't know the rules there, and if there's an off lead area I suppose people shouldn't be taking their dogs there if they have a dog problem. I just read that Tilly does this when approaching dogs on lead, and that dogs have growled and warned her away, to which she continues to snap at them? That is what I was referring to, at that point I would intervene and stop the interaction, then take her away from the dog that isn't happy and perhaps do some watch me and general obedience exercises. I suppose coming from an owner of a nervous dog who has to put up with unruly off lead dogs harassing mine, I may have come across a little sharp, but just because other owners can't control their dogs, it doesn't mean that you shouldn't yours also! But of course, it's great that you are looking to get help and if she's going through a bit of a "pushing the boundaries" stage, a long line really is your best option. You can continue to train her recall that way, but also keep her and other dogs safe from harm. It doesn't have to be forever, providing you can ensure 100% recall before you let her off the line in the future is she "foodie" at all? Cheese and liver are guaranteed to get Biscuit bombing it back to me every time! I also call her back at various times during the walk just for a treat, so that her coming back doesn't always mean end of a walk or stopping something that she enjoys

Some of us have been there at some point. That one day in the woods last year when Pixee went after another dog, she was just nosey and wanted to check that dog over, something I was very unhappy about as she wouldnt come back on my recall either. And to make matters worse, the lady and her dog kept walking on instead of stopping so I couldnt catch up and grab Pixee. I was angry when I caught up, but did not direct it at Pixee as I knew I would have only made matters worse. I apoloised to the lady and asked her if she would stand still, which she did. I finally got Pixee back, never said a word to Pixee, just put her on a very short lead, thanks the lady, and I walked home quiet, put Pixee on her mat and left her there a while. From that day on, she has never approached another dog without my say so. You see I found out from this forum, that staffies dont like to be ignored, and granted I was lucky that way just once did work for us. But I do agree about going back to basics and using a long line. I never stop any form of training, its always on going. I brought a new whistie with a clicker on a few weeks back. I only want to use it for recall, (Having lost a few whistles) So I trained Pixee that each time I use the clicker, she will get a reward. When I first used it, in the home, the first time, she looked at me, so I rewarded her. She soon got the ideal that each time I clicked, she would get a reward. I tested it in the fields too. And so far it has worked brillant. Although she does come on me calling her, my problem is I cant hear my voice, so I am never sure if I am loud enough or end up like I am too loud. I use it for when she is off lead and away from me. You will get there one way or the another. Keep us posted on how you are doing.

This is a very similar issue we have with Rocky, so he is now kept on a training line for 95% of the time. We do have one place where we can take him to let him off where there are absolutely no distractions, this is where we go at the weekends. Unless you have 100% percent recall !00% of the time the dog really should be on a lead of some sort. How would you feel about a dog approaching you appearing to be out of control and loose ??

Kathy - that has happened to me more times than Tilly has done it to others!! Clearly we walk in an unruly area.

I think what I'm taking from this is that as Tilly isn't a foodie, isn't noise orientated and, deriving from a wild animal, won't ever be 100% in control 100% of the time she will have to be on her lead all of the time.

I appreciate the suggestions regarding the long line but we walk in a wooded area and think i'd have less control if she was 50ft away with it tangled up in branches and bushes.

I don't think any dog has 100% recall, some may have 99% but we don't own our dogs minds.

I will continue with my basic commands as suggested.

Thanks