Toilet training - Sooooo confused

Hi All,
We recently got our new edition Dusty (the puppy) to our family and already had Ellie who we got at 18 months and was fully clean and trained. I have read loads and am getting constantly confused by the toilet training. We always praise her for doing her toilet outside (both types). When we come in from an outing without the dogs we do not talk to them just take them outside (telling them wee wee) for a toilet and praise them when they go. We then clean any accidents from the puppy mats on the floor in two locations where the pup can go. When we are in the house the back door is left open and there are no pads on the floor. I have now read that i should be closing the door and making the pup ask to go out or try to read her movements ir going round in circle to indicate she needs to go out, to train her to hold it. But if there are pads down when we are out surely she thinks it is ok to go when she likes and will not learn to hold it? Sorry so long winded but soooooo confused. Door open? door closed? Pads down? Pads not down? Each time i think its right another reading contradicts my earlier reading.

Everyone has a different method and there really is no wrong way IMO. We use door closed and pad on the floor. Here is a link that might be helpfull

http://staffy-bull-terrier.co.uk/toilettrainingyourstaffie.html

Hiya our puppy is now 4 months old and pretty much completely toilet trained, we never used puppy mats or newspaper because we found they didnt help us in anyway,

at first he wee'd pood everywhere so what we did was take him out AS SOON as he wakes up from any nap or sleep hes having, and if he is awake then every 10-15 mins wed take him out and praise him for doing it outside, if he did it inside we would just wipe it up and say nothing to him.

I dont think using pads and stuff is such a good idea because they will learn to go on them and when you take them away it maybe confusing/difficault.

Don't leave the door open, otherwise they do not realise the difference from outside and inside - keep it closed untill you go to take him out..

This is what weve done and its worked

I'm not a fan of paper or pads as it's just confusing for the dog, one minute it's OK to pee in the house then the next it's not. Pups should be taken outside at least once every two hours then there is no need for paper or pads. How long is the pup being left alone?

Leaving the door open is a no no IMO too as if the pup takes itself out to pee/poo then no one is there to reward so the pup doesn't know it's just done something right which makes the training process much slower.

Pads are mainly used at night because she always has one wee and a poo in the night (usually on the same pad). Her last feed is at 20:00 and she is let out last at about 22:00 she does not wake until 7:00, when we take them both out. Not sure what time in the night she wees but no noise. In the day she is with Ellie (other dog) for about 2 1/2 hours. when we also leave pads down during this time she usually just wees.

I'm not a fan of paper or pads either.

I'd go one further than galadriel - I take a pup out into the garden at least every hour, plus whenever they first wake up, when they've just eaten (but only for toilet, no running games) & when they've got excited from playing.

I don't tell my dog off for toileting in the house (I just clean it up with biological washing liquid solution), but I do give heeps of silly praise when they go outside.

One thing to remember is that puppies do not have full control over their bladders/bowels until at least 4-5 months old (quite often longer) and will often have the odd little accident - and that's all it is, an accident. they're not doing it deliberately to spite you, or to be naughty. That's why they shouldn't be told off.

Would never tell them off for accidents although sometimes i do think that she does it on purpose. But read that by telling her off would shame her and make her go where i could not see it. maybe will move the pads when she is three and a half months slowly to the garden.

When I was on Victoria Stillwell's forum I got fed up with so many quetions about this, alll I can do is tell you what has worked for me from 6 week old pups to a 6 year old dog. This is what I put up on the other forum.

How to toilet train your pup or adult dog.

It is very important to us humans for our dogs not to toilet in our homes but teaching a dog not to seems to be causing a lot of problems. It doesn't matter how young or old your dog is, they can still be toilet trained but you have to be very consistent, slip up once, and it will set your dog back.

First make sure you have several days free to concentrate on toilet training your dog, you need this to get it established for yourself and your dog. Dogs learn by being repetitive, miss and your dog goes backwards.

1. Never try to teach your dog to toilet on paper or pads.
Many dogs taught this way never learn to toilet outside because they have been taught it is ok to toilet inside, dogs don't generalise and don't understand that they can't toilet inside when there is no paper or pads.

2. Keep all outside doors closed while you are toilet training no matter how hot it is.
If you have the outside doors open your dog doesn't know where the house stops and the garden begins, this really does confuse your dog so all doors must be closed.

3. Always take your dog outside, never put him out while training him.
If you put your dog outside you can't see when he goes, if you can't see him go you can't tell him that is what you want him to do by giving him lots and lots and lots and lots of praise, party, make him feel is the best thing since sliced bread. Many give dogs treats but I prefer to use praise.

Puppies do a double wee, they go outside, you praise and bring them in only for your puppy to go on your lovely, white carpet, this is normal, with pups once they have gone and you have had a party, take him for a walk round the garden/yard to give him the chance to do the double wee.

4. Take him outside as soon as he wakes up
Dogs normally want to toilet when they wake up so take him outside and give him the chance to. This is for afternoon snoozes or anytime your dog sleeps.

5. Take him outside before and after he is fed.
Some dogs prefer to go before being fed, some after and some like to go before and after they have been fed.

6. Take him outside after a training or play session.

Often after a play or training session the dog relaxes and needs to toilet so give your dog the chance to do this by taking him outside as soon as these are over.

7. Take him outside ever 30/45 minutes for pups, every hour for adult dogs.
Pups like human babies are not developed enough to hold when they need to go, they have to release it, we have nappies on our babies but expect pups to know they have to go outside, they don't. We have to give them the chance to toilet where we want them to by taking them there at times that will suit their needs not ours. If you go over this time to finish a job you are doing and your dog toilets in the house, that is your fault not your dog's so roll up a newspaper and hit yourself over the head with it saying "I must take my dog out to toilet when he should go".

8. If your dog does go inside, put him outside before you clean up.
With many dogs or pups it won't matter if you clean up in front of them but with a sensitive dog it does. No matter how much we try if a dog toilets inside our body language changes, dogs pick up on this and think they have done something wrong, they haven't, they have not yet learnt to toilet outside. By putting the dog outside before we clean up, the dog doesn't get the same chance to think he has done wrong. Dogs that think they have done something wrong are harder to train. They will sometimes try to hide it or do it behind the furniture which you don’t want.

9. What to clean up with.
Never use normal household cleaners, most have ammonia in which encourages a dog to toilet in that spot again. Even though we can't smell the wee, our dogs can because they have a much better smell than we do. You have to take the smell away for the dog as well as us.

You can clean up with white vinegar or biological washing liquid or buy something for the job from a pet shop. They will all take the smell away for your dog which is very important when you are training your dog.

Some breeds are easier to train than others, some dogs are more excitable than others, some dogs are slow to pick things up like this, no matter how quick or slow your dog is it is very important to be consistent, only by being consistent will you succeed in teaching your dog to toilet outside and not in.

With pups remember that their bodies are not mature, they may not be capable of holding so don't expect them to. It is normal for a pup to go through the night even though they are not mature enough to hold, this is because their bodies, like ours, slows down when we are asleep. With very young pups, they will be clean and dry quicker if you get up during the night to take them outside to toilet, by stopping them from toileting in the house completely by taking them out, they don't get mixed messages.

If you have an adult rescue dog that isn’t toilet training you don’t know what has been tried in the past so treat this dog as not having any training and start at the beginning. Many are still taught to toilet on pads or newspaper, this will make it more difficult but can be done especially as you don’t know how they have been taught. Some maybe toilet trained but their time in rescue may have stopped this, this happens a lot, and of course there is stress, often a stressed dog will toilet inside for many reasons.

It isn't difficult to toilet train a dog or pup but does take a lot of work but well worth the effort when they are clean.

No harm in starting to move them even now, its a nuisance at the start having to take them out every 15-20 mins but it definately helps