Introducing a pup, to a pup..

Just a insite on my first staffy

I have a Irish blue bitch, called Daisy who is 14 months (still a pup in my eyes but)
She's loving, hypo, gentle & loves playing.. She sleeps in our bed with us and has the kitchen and living room of a day why we are in work (my wife only goes to work at 9:30am and is home at 12:30 for a hour, then I finish at 4:30) so she's never left alone to long.

We are picking a puppy staffy up tonight (was 8 weeks old on Monday) she is also a bitch, we have a pen (which we intend on keeping her in why we are at work so they can be close to one another but a cage in the way?, and of a night (why Daisy sleeps with us)


Just a couple of questions, and advice of you's would be a massive help.

1) I see a lot of people get a bitch and a boy staffy- is there any reason for this? Will 2 girls be fine together ?
2) is it wise to keep a pen in the kitchen with the pup in, and leaving our other staffy wandering around the kitchen & living room (she sleeps on the couch why we are at work)
3) is Daisy to at 14 months to young to have a pup intruding in her space?

Any advice is muchly appreciated.

I think it does depend on temperament, there are people on the forum with 2 bitches that get on well, but having said that it's not something that I would risk. 2 bitches are much more likely to fight - especially terriers - and when they do fight they tend to do more damage. Has you girl spent extensive time with both bitches and dogs with no negative reactions? What is her personality like, compared with the new pups?

I would separate them when left. For a while at least. Some people never leave their dogs alone together.

At 14 months she's an adolescent - coming into adulthood. If she's not well trained by this point, this could be a problem. But also be prepared for her to completely forget her training and try to push the boundaries whilst she's in the "teenager phase."

Mine are all boys so I am not much of help to answer the questions on having 2 females together. But I think you should keep them separate at least till she is older and you know how their personalities are together.

My older dogs were a bit grumpy for a few weeks. They would give me the look of "really Mom, a puppy?" But now they love each other. Sure they still have their moments but someone is always there to watch them and we know now when the older dogs need a small break from the puppy.

I would allow them to be together supervised as much as you can. They need to learn how to interact and your little one will benefit from early socialising. Most dogs do seem to know how far to go, and they also do seem to recognise that a puppy should be played with differently. It might look rough at times but that is how staffies play, so you might need to brace yourself!

But yes, when you are not there I'd keep them apart for the time being.

First hour - Daisy (14month Irish blue) was pushing the pup around with nose and smelling her a lot. Not giving her a minute.. Pup was coward anyway near are feet and kept trying to get away.

We have attempted pup in cage next to our bed, and Daisy in our bed (that's where she usually stays) but pup won't stop crying and barking (understandably) so now I'm on the couch with Daisy and wife is in bed with the pup (out the cage) as its her first night and she'll be petrified.

Only one show of aggression was when the pup was crying / barking in the cage and Daisy was out side the cage and growled.

Hi johnny this is a new thing for daisy and as above the dogs shouldnt be alone together. With regards to daisy growling outside the cage shes trying to show the pup whos boss and reminding the pup whos territory it is . As regards to the pup in the cage dnt lock them there too much as they will eventually have a fear of small spaces its important to give the daisy and the pup equal freedom. How old is the pup ? Id walk them together if possible so they can get used to one another on seperate leads let them have a sniff of one another and give pup and daisy equal amounts of attention this will lesson daisys chances of becoming resentful/jealous if the pup. Its important you monitor daisy closely lots of changes will occour during the teenage phase so perhaps taking her back to basics will help training the pup at the same time may increase the chances of them getting along better.

First night was - tiring to say the least took pup (Roxy) out in the night 3 times didn't do pop or wee, wee'd in bed and poo'd in living room haha! But can still understand she's scared leaving all her litter mates & mum.

Seem to be getting on well and the post up there ^^ saying 'it might look rough' has given me a breathe of fresh air as I'm the one panicking and my wife is like 'their just playing' but seems Daisy is to much for the puppy at the minute. She doesn't try and play she just cowers away why Daisy is pushing her around with her nose and sniffing her... Is this normal/ok?

I'm not worried about Daisy hurting the pup because I don't think she would but it doesn't look to nice for the pup as she's just left everybody she knows to come into a new home and get pushed around by a bigger dog!

Roxy (The pup) seems to be growling a lot at Daisy now..

Obviously it's just a 'leave me a alone' shout but with Daisy only being young herself could take it the wrong way.

Daisy is harassing Roxy and won't give her a minute but put one in the crate or Daisy in another room and they won't stop crying!

I have one dog myself hope someone with 2 dogs can help

Thanks Mia. Was half asleep when I read your first post- potty duties at 3am haha!

The pup is 9 weeks Monday so not allowed out yet. They seem okay together but Daisy does constantly want to play with Roxy(the pup) who gets fed up of it and growls. Daisy is a gentle dog but is a bit in your face overly hypo.

Everything is still very overwhelming for Roxy and Daisy. This might go on for a few more days but as time passes things will get much easier. Maybe take Daisy on an extra-long walk to get her super tired so she is not all up in puppies face to play?

I think the puppy is just still confused in what has happened to her and why she is not with her littler mates and mother. Everything smells and looks different and then she has this other older pup that is all up in her face 

We use the “leave it” command and so far all 3 dogs listen to it now and it makes life so much easier when you know that they understand what that means. So now when big brother eats a bone little guy knows not to go near him when we say leave it!

This has been puppies first day/night and it will take some time to get used to. Give her some space to adjust to her new surroundings. I am sure both will be doing just fine 

Well... We went out for a family meal tonight.

Roxy (pup) was in her pen in the kitchen, radio on, lamp on, heating on. Daisy who has the kitchen and the living room (she can get close to the pen just in hope they get use to each other but with a gate separating them!

Anyway... Get in from the meal, was roughly gone 3hours.
Open the living room door to Daisy greeting us from the arm of the couch.. Look behind and Roxy is on the couch following.. She's only gone and escaped her pen somehow!!

Why I know this is VERY dangerous, it's also a bit releving knowing they've been together and Daisy hasn't done anything stupid to Roxy.

Once we come in greet both Daisy did get a bit jealous but after 24hrs that's understandable, right?

I have had two bitches before and for 90% of the time they tolerated each other. I would not say they got along. Just because one didn't kill the other didn't mean they were okay. When they fought, which happened about 3 times in the 9 years, they blooomin fought. I had a very badly bloodied dog whos face swollen up to three times the size it should have been and my dad had the shotgun ready for the other but thankfully they were both ok with a bit of TLC and vet care.

The worst part, is that one dog was taken (some do gooder thought she was a stray when she was in my yard, why i have no idea...she was in my yard!!) and i had to get the police involved cause she refused to give her back cause she had "scars from fighting"

Being accused of being involved with something so horrific was soul destroying. I'm just glad the person was a decent enough one to be so worried!

Im not saying all this to scare you, two bitches can get on the very best, just don't become complacent and you must learn your dogs body behavior.

Oh god! I'm hoping because their both basically pups they'll grow to be mates! My hearts in my mouth when Daisy is pushing Roxy around with her nose so god knows how I'll react if they actual fight

Daisy is now seeming to be a bit rougher only shoving Roxy under her body with her legs / nose but now Roxy is starting to growl & snap at Daisy... Which obviously doesn't go down to well with Daisy.

Is this normal ? Could really do with knowing

Daisy's behaviour is completely normal so please stop worrying. All she is doing is letting Roxy know who is in charge, the more Roxy growls and barks the more Daisy will try to put her in her place. Eventually Roxy will realise this and both of their behaviours will stop, but if she continues to go up against Daisy, Daisy will get a little more aggressive with her but again this is nothing to worry about. As Roxy gets bigger you may find that Daisy will push her under her and lay on her, Roxy will squeal but again this is just Daisy showing who is boss and as soon as Roxy stops wriggling Daisy will get up and let her go. I have always had two girls together (I currently have two female litter mates who are 21 weeks old) and have personally never had any problems with them, no fights, nothing! All of my girls have always loved each other and have often been inseparable, always playing and cuddling with each other (and me of course!). If they are about to fight you will notice that both dogs ears will pin right back to their head, their tails will not be wagging, their heads will be slightly lowered and their hackles will be up whilst they both growl and bare their teeth at each other (the hackles is when the fur on their back between the shoulder blades raises and almost stands up straight). It will only be when you see all of these signs that you are witnessing a real fight about to happen between them both. In this case it is best to remove one of them. Also be careful with how you are comforting the puppy. Letting Roxy sleep in the bed and having Daisy sleep on the sofa is not a good idea. As far as Daisy is concerned the bed is where she sleeps, it is her territory and by taking her out of it and putting Roxy in it it will be seen by Daisy as you giving away her territory and authority, which could also lead to Roxy fighting against Daisy's authority. If they are playing do not pick Roxy up, even if you think Daisy is getting too rough.Again this will be seen as favouring by both of the dogs, giving Roxy power over Daisy that she shouldn't have. Instead, just move Daisy back and hold her there for a couple of seconds and then release her but do not comfort or fuss Roxy while you are doing this. Also, you mention that Roxy got out of her pen, is Daisy big enough to get over the top either by stepping or jumping? If so it may be that Daisy got her over the gate by carrying her by her scruff on her neck. As soon as Roxy realises that Daisy is the dominant dog and the one in charge I personally cannot see you having problems with them both. I hope I have helped a little xx

Thank you Linzi this has reassured me ALOT. I didn't think it would be plain sailing and I have read staffy's 'playing' or what not looks rough and not a pleasure to watch.

It's just with Daisy doing all this (Knocking her about with her nose, standing over the top of her, nipping her ears / neck) and Roxy basically moving from her litter mates & mum and having this bigger dog bullying her.. First night she was just running to a corner and cowering away- now she's obviously started growling, barking & nipping back... Daisy still hasn't shown no aggressive signs just stands on/over her more.

In regards of the bed Daisy was back in our bed last night why Roxy was in her Pen, every time she woke up and cried I went down 11:30pm, 2am & 5am and let her out in the back to do her business, then I'd pop her back in the pen and stroke
Her head why she dozed back off then I'd leave her again and get back in bed..

Daisy cannot get over the pen, or at least shown no signs that she can.. We're thinking Roxy has stood on her bed and got over.. Surely it's a good sign that they've potentially been together 3 hours alone and nothing has happened?

but thanks again that post has stopped me worrying... for now.

Just hard watching a little 8 week old pup cower away

Roxy is the on getting aggressive towards Daisy now.

I know Roxy obviously can't hurt Daisy as she's 5 times as big, just worries me that Roxy might nip Daisy and she could just turn (Which she hasn't shown any signs of)

Think it's just a 'stop bullying me' cry.

I wonder if you're thinking a bit too much in human terms - bullying is something kids do to each other that's not nice, usually ganging up on a weaker one out of spite, but dogs don't do that. They don't have that nasty streak.

The first thing to remember is that puppies aren't aggressive. They can be amazingly rough and sometimes make sounds that we think of as aggressive but the intent behind them isn't aggression. It's all about learning how to interact, how to use and not abuse your strength, how far you can go and when is too far.

If Daisy does snap, and she might, what you'll probably get is a 'near miss' snap, usually directed at the head without making contact, that is very sharp and just once. Unless you have similar strength/personality dogs what happens is that the other one realises they've gone too far and backs off. They do not go into fight just like that unless there is a problem, especially not at that age.

I'm not saying that will absolutely get on, and it's impossible for us to be 100% sure from here because we can't see, but the likelihood is that everything is fine.

So you need to stop worrying because that can only create a sense of tension which might transmit to the dogs. As Linzi-Jo says (good post!) if you feel you need to give either one time out, do so quietly and without making a fuss of either of them. I would be teaching 'enough' so that you can get them to stop playing whenever you need. If for no other reason than 2 young staffs playing can turn your house upside down in a blink if you don't have an off switch!

I totally get it, I also have a 20 month old male staffy cross and he did all of the same things with my two pups that Daisy is doing with Roxy and it was horrible to watch it as all I wanted to do was grab them and protect them but we have to remember that dogs aren't humans and they have their own ways of sorting things out which to us can seem aggressive but to them is nothing. Daisy would not turn, she may bark at Roxy or nip her back harder to put her back in her place but it would be nothing that will cause her any lasting physical or psychological damage, Roxy's mum would have done the same if her and her litter mates had been getting too agressive towards each other, it's how they learn when enough is enough. You will probably find that Daisy will take on a lot of the mothers behaviours to continue teaching Roxy what is right and wrong.

Yes it is a very good sign that they were together and nothing happened. If dogs get time to sleep, play and cuddle together it tends to increase their bond (as will walking together when Roxy is old enough), which is obviously what you want. Dogs are pack animals remember, so they happiest when they aren't alone x

I also agree with Liz about the enough command. The sooner you get that ingrained into them the better x

Ok, first off RELAX. Roxy will want to play and will learn from Daisy when enough is enough over time. Roxy may appear to be rough but as you've already heard, they can look aggressive whilst playing.

If you're feeling tense Daisy will certainly pick up on it and it's quiet likely that Roxy will too even though she is still very young.

The "Enough" command is something to work on straight away as soon as you see things getting a little too rough. Remember to reward both when they do as asked.

It's very early days and so far the signs are good in that they've managed to steal some time together and all has been fine but do carry on being cautious about leaving them alone for now and until you get a better idea of how well they are socialising. There is nothing to say that two girls cannot become the best of buddies and the more you socialise them together the better it should be.

As soon as you can get Roxy out after jabs etc, do get them walking together and when home let them have seperate drinks/feed and then see if they settle down together, hopefully they will as they will be tired. This should allow them to bond more.

Dogs are no stupid. They won't attack for no reason and will very much put another dog in its place before letting it get to violence. Try not to worry so much. My Lexis idea of play is to grab anything and shake, including my other dog, whos three times her size so just needs to walk away and she can't hold him lol

Everybody keeps telling me to relax I think I am going a bit OTT.

Roxy keeps biting Daisy's face and Daisy doesn't snap back so that's a good sign right?

Daisy seems like she's pushing Roxy against walls / couch / anything and nipping her ears and neck.. In which Roxy will growl and bite back.. The whole time Daisy's tail is wagging.

At times it looks like Roxy the pup is half doing it to wind Daisy up. They was on the couch playing with a tennis ball and Roxy kept robbing it and trying to run off Daisy would push her over take the ball back then Roxy would run straight back over trying to get the ball.

They've also been drinking out of Daisy's water bowl (Roxys is in her pen) and Daisy didn't bat a eyelid- let Roxy drink from it and even joined it.

Still got me worried when Roxy is still biting Daisy's face but I think Daisy realises she's a pup.


Thanks for your advice it's been brill and chilled me right out.

I'm just worried roxy's shape teeth will hurt Daisy's face and she MAY snap. which she's shown no sign of yet.

Sounds to me like they are playing just great together. Sharing a water bowl at the same time is a great indication that they are both comfortable in each other's company.

Just be mindful to stop anything too rough but other than that, let the fun continue

Thats 100% play. My dogs do that too. I'm trying to find a video for you to settle your nerves.

Let the fun continue haha! There is nothing fun about it just yet it's hard to watch!

Seemed like they was slightly better with one another this morning was watching more carefully at body language the pup is giving as good as she gets once she's free from a side / corner standing up on two legs and fighting / playing back.

Iv seen the pup basically hanging off Daisy's top / side lip and Daisy not react badly just playing tsill(still not nice to watch though)

I agree. It all just sounds like play. The older the puppy gets the rougher play will look and sound! You will see both with their mouth wide open making noises while they bite ears, paws, tail and legs. They will take turns with rolling eachother on their back and pinning the other down!

Puppy teeth are super sharp and hurt. You will hear Daisy yelp but thats ok because it will teach pup to play more gentle.

I'm afraid you're going to have to get used to it. As Cecil15 says, this isn't just during puppyhood that you'll see rough play, but for years to come. We often have people worried that our dogs are fighting - the sounds and faces are not for the faint hearted - and it is jaw dropping what they will do to each other then come back for more. Only on a couple of occasions have any of them even been marked, and not once have any of them been the slightest bit worried.

Sorry to be a bit blunt, but if you're not happy to have this level of rough play in your house maybe having two young staffs together isn't the wisest choice. They cannot be other than they are and to hope that they'll learn play quietly is probably going to leave you disappointed (and frustrated). You either have to learn to laugh, which is what most multi-dog households do, brace yourself for a rough ride for the foreseeable future, or bail out now before they get too bonded.

I would also have a good hard think about how you are going to deal with leaving them when you are out, as keeping them in separate cages for any length of time is to my mind unfair and will probably lead to frustration on their part, but it sounds like having them roughhousing round the living room isn't part of what you're planning on either. My view is that damage goes with the territory (the best so far is to find they'd had a tug of war with a feather duvet), but again if you're not going to be happy with that the time to think is now, not in a couple of months.

I'm not not happy, I just wanted advice on the matter as of course it is new to me and my wife.

As long as I know it's okay what they are doing I'm chilled- I was flapping when I wrote this post but a few posts have stopped that and I realise now it's what their going to do. As now iv just let them do their thing all day today having the living room / kitchen / garden why I'm watching telly. Obviously watching them when they creep into the back!

I know what your saying about it but how is anybody meant to learn if that's the attitude to have. I love dogs- I love staffs- not every household was a multi dog household.. I was just worried, which is normal when it's new to me?

Either are locked in small places. Roxy(the pup) is in a rather large Pen in the kitchen, Daisy has the kitchen & the living room..
The pup stays in the pen downstairs, Daisy stays in bed with us as she has for a year.

Sorry! You sounded really worried, even in your last posts, and I'm always concerned when people sound worried. But as long as you're chilled and everyone's happy, then that's cool!

When you're ready I hope they'll be able to sleep together, day and night, and you'll be able to leave them together knowing that they'll be fine. Then it'll be happy families all round.

It is a whole new learning curve having two Staffies. Many people do and they are just fine. The concern that people have is that this can become too much and then they are put in the position of having to part with one, that's where Liz is coming from I think.

Sounds to me as though the last few days have been an eye opener for you and hopefully we've given you some reassurance that all is normal and provided you get some rules in place early on, you'll have two happy Staffies for comp at for many years

PS... We would love to see some pics

Sorry if I sounded grumpy it's been a LONG 4 days!

I do understand what you's are saying and I don't think many people would expect this? It looks rough and its constant but I'm ready as now iv got the reassurance it's normal to be this rough. Roxy is now giving as good as she get gets. Iv been watching them for the past 40 mins on the couch next to me and Daisy has had her lips bit again and Roxy has been hanging off her legs haha.. Daisy's tail hasn't stopped waggling though.

Every time they've needed water they've both walked to Daisy's water bowl using it together then Roxy has been licking water off Daisy's face.

Signs are good just wasn't aware for how rough it would be. Will be easier when I can tire both out on the field when Roxy is old enough.

How do I upload pics ? And vids if possible.

JohnnyRoberts wrote: Will be easier when I can tire both out on the field when Roxy is old enough.

How do I upload pics ? And vids if possible.

You think you'll tire them out??? Let us in on the secret if you manage it!

Here's how to upload photos and videos. Can't wait to see them!

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t12017-how-to-post-a-photos-onto-the-forum

For some reason it won't work

Try introducing a pup to 2 adult cats

You can also upload to Flickr if you have an account, then cut and paste the link, and there's an icon to link to a YouTube video on the bit just above the comment box (like where I'm typing now).

What happened when you tried through Photobucket?

Every time I post threw photo bucket it just comes up with the same screen, every time I press 'send' it's just the same screen and doesn't post it.

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Very strange dos the link you posted works but for some reason won't display the picture

Ah ha... I see you've done it

Oh my word, look at that nose!!!

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Great pics of the two of them

Great pictures love the pups nose . That face  

She has dumbo ear's haha!

Daisy will look more in proportion once she develops and matures cute pair tho. Its a pity  a pup never acts as cute as they look .