The REAL History of the APBT

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 17:19

The REAL Pit Bull Inc. of New Jersey, USA has a great history section. It's pretty long and goes back pretty far. Check it out if you're interested!

http://www.realpitbull.com/history.html

by **Steve** Wed Oct 17 2012, 19:17

Pit Bulls were imported to America shortly before the Civil War, and used
in much the same manner as they were back in England. But in the USA
the breed solidified and was named - the American Pit Bull Terrier. Strains
of the fighting dog that remained in England later came to be known as
Staffordshire Bull Terriers. There is speculation as to how closely related
the Stafford and Pit Bull are as a breed, but the most convincing case is
made up of claims that they are a similar breed, developed during the
same time, made up of similar but separate strains of bulldog and terrier
blood. Cousins, but not brothers. The Staffordshire Bull Terrier became
recognized as a breed by the English dog registry, the Kennel Club, in
1935.

i'm not sure about that bit the bull & terrier was imported & the staffy was just another line from the bull & terrier as well bull terrier & the bosten terrier

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 20:20

Steve wrote:i'm not sure about that bit the bull & terrier was imported & the staffy was just another line from the bull & terrier as well bull terrier & the bosten terrier

From the research I've done that seems about right, though a bit simplified. What do you believe is the truth?

by **Steve** Wed Oct 17 2012, 20:23

i think people from the uk and irish took their Bull & terriers & cross breed with other terrier to make the american pitbul terrier & american staffordshire terrier

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:18

I'm sure there was some crossbreeding with other terriers/bulldogs, but a LOT of early APBTs look very similar to early SBTs, so I wouldn't discount the idea that SBTs are "ancestors" of some APBT lines, or at least that SBTs and APBTs share common ancestors.

I think the breeds are a lot more closely related than some care to admit. I also don't see that as a bad thing any more that I see Labs and Goldens being related breeds as a bad thing. It isn't good or bad, it just is.

Both SBTs and APBT/AmStaffs are great breeds with great temperaments. Both breeds deserve respect and neither breed deserves to be banned. I think most (hopefully all) of the forum members can agree on that much.

by **Steve** Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:21

pitbulls, staffy, boston terrier and bull terrier (also mini bull terriers) are from bull and terrier lines

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:32

CatStina wrote: or at least that SBTs and APBTs share common ancestors.

That's what I believe. The ancestors of both breeds are Bull & Terrier. It was the Bull & Terriers that went to the USA, not the Stafford. Both breeds then developed seperately, although along similar lines.

by **Steve** Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:42

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:49

Some have said that the Boston Terrier (formerly known as the Boston Bulldog) was actually just a regional variety of Pit Bull. I don't have any evidence to back up that claim, it's just something I've seen on several Bull Breed forums/FB pages. Where is the evidence to back up the above flow chart? I don't agree that Boston Bulldogs/Terriers are older than all other Bull and Terrier breeds as the graphic implies...

by **Steve** Wed Oct 17 2012, 21:56

CatStina wrote: Bulldogs/Terriers are older than all other Bull and Terrier breeds as the graphic implies...

i didn't have enough room to line them all up

by Guest Wed Oct 17 2012, 22:08

Oh, ok then!

by **Andy** Thu Oct 18 2012, 09:49

Caryll wrote:
CatStina wrote: or at least that SBTs and APBTs share common ancestors.

That's what I believe. The ancestors of both breeds are Bull & Terrier. It was the Bull & Terriers that went to the USA, not the Stafford. Both breeds then developed seperately, although along similar lines.

Nail on head, and my understanding also.

by Guest Thu Oct 18 2012, 12:05

CatStina wrote:Some have said that the Boston Terrier (formerly known as the Boston Bulldog) was actually just a regional variety of Pit Bull. I don't have any evidence to back up that claim, it's just something I've seen on several Bull Breed forums/FB pages.

Dr David Harris says that the Boston Terrier was developed seperately from the APBT although from similar lines. I tend to go along with his way of thinking, but only because he has researched all the 'Blockhead' breeds (what he calls the Bull & Terrier breeds) so extensively.

by Guest Thu Oct 18 2012, 15:28

I think the flowchart is really oversimplified and there was a lot more interbreeding than it implies. Were breeds developed separately? Of course, but, at least from what I've read, there was a lot of interbreeding/crossbreeding of the Bull and Terrier Breeds to create the individual breeds that people were looking for.

by **Steve** Thu Oct 18 2012, 15:57

yes there was plenty of interbreeding & crossbreeding that still happen today... etc all the type in the uk, it's abit like the american bully i think their about 5 different lines these day they all come from the old type standard

by Guest Thu Oct 18 2012, 17:03

CatStina wrote:I think the flowchart is really oversimplified and there was a lot more interbreeding than it implies.

Flowcharts like that have to be simplified or it would be so complicated that you wouldn't be able to follow it! Basically it just says that all the blockheads came from Bull & terrier lines, but were developed seperately.

by **Andy** Thu Oct 18 2012, 19:59

"blockhead" ... Big Grin

... and you have just witnessed the birth of Max's new nickname Laughing

by Guest Thu Oct 18 2012, 22:42

Andy wrote:"blockhead" ... ... and you have just witnessed the birth of Max's new nickname

It's a good description of the bull breeds, isn't it? Laughing

David Harris has just brought out a new book which I'm getting for Christmas - a present from the oh & two kids because it's soooo expensive! It's limited edition (only 200 printed so far) and David Harris has agreed to put one aside for me for a week or two till we've got the money together. It's $175 including postage! Surprised

But it's a really big book & is the definitive history of the Bull Terrier.

by Guest Thu Oct 18 2012, 23:20

wow thats an expensive read , can I borrow it when you're done Big Grin

by Guest Fri Oct 19 2012, 00:05

I think god sent them angel

by Guest Fri Oct 19 2012, 07:28

Hayley wrote:I think god sent them

Could be right there Smile

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