Driving to Poland with staffy.

Hi
We're planning to drive to Poland this summer and of course we're taking Debo. Was just thinking about driving through Europe, can we expect any problems regarding Debo? He's staffy, but not KC registered,his mum is but dad isn't.

found this link

http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-pets/pets/travel/

dont know if it will help

As long as Debo has had his jabs (they need extra ones for when they travel) and has a passport then no you'll be fine

jola139 wrote:Hi
We're planning to drive to Poland this summer and of course we're taking Debo. Was just thinking about driving through Europe, can we expect any problems regarding Debo? He's staffy, but not KC registered,his mum is but dad isn't.

Check it out properly

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t13095-pet-passport-french-dda-ammendment?highlight=passport
http://gowen.org/staffie-to-france-non/
https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t5541-staffys-to-france?highlight=france

I personally won't take the risk as Tilly doesn't have papers and don't want to ruin a holiday or lose money

I'm not so sure you'll have time to get all the necessary innoculations & paperwork done - when are you going?

Sorry have no experience of it but for goodness sake please make sure you have all the relevent paperwork in place and have checked everything, cross all the t's and dot all the i's.

If it were me there is no way I would take my dog abroad anyway. Much safer in recommended kennels, but thats just me.

You will need to phone DEFRA (see the link supplied by Lynne above) and tell them exactly which countries you will be travelling through because each country will have its own rules. Then you will need to get the right paperwork & innoculations completed before you travel.

You really don't have much time. I would be far more inclined not to put a puppy through all of that, and find a decent kennel to board her in while you are away.

Ok,will check with them,when we decided on Staffy we didn't know there would be a problem taking him abroad,of course will do what best for him.

Also staffs are banned in some countries, ie Germany!
My geography is crap so I don't know if you would pass thru there or not!

Really? Yes, most of the journey is in Germany.

Just called them,they are useless. Didn't give me any informations,they told me there shouldn't be a problem and gave phone number to polish embassy. Don't know really where to check ,do you think shoul contact all the countries we are gonna travel ? France,Belgium,Netherlands ,GErmany and POland

I think must vets operate a pet passport scheme, as your pet requires a passport to be able to travel.
Why don't you start there and hopefully they'll give you some contact numbers and also tell you if it's possible to do it in your timescale!

I'm pretty sure about them being banned in Germany too, but that was only going by things I found online, nothing official!

You can't import a staff into Germany, but I don't know if you can take one through the country if your end destination is another country.

I'd contact the Embassies in each country you will be driving through to see what the restrictions are.

Just looked up the rabies vaccination - your dog has to be over 3 months old before it can be vaccinated against rabies & this vaccination is essential for a pet passport. I don't know how long after the vaccination you have to wait before you can travel.

You should also be aware that some countries (France, for example) could query your pup's breed. If he is not a registered Staffordshire Bull Terrier & you do not have Kennel Club documents for him, then they could refuse to let you take him into the country. I think the same may be true of other European countries.

As I said, you should check with the relevant Embassies & then with your vets as to the timescale for getting a pet passport.

I never new it was so complicated I have friends who take there dog away all the time and I was thinking about doing it with Moo next year! They make it out to be very simple now I'm a little confused!!

sounds a nightmare

*Karen* wrote:Also staffs are banned in some countries, ie Germany!
My geography is crap so I don't know if you would pass thru there or not!

For info apparently they are not banned in Germany , it seems to possibly be a district thing and I think about import of staffies, I was surprised as I thought the same but we had a german breeder say hello a few months ago and I've since found another one

Ok.,will ask the vet. It's not like we are going to wonder around any of those countries,the only border control he have go through is before we get to euro tunel train. Called franch embassy and they said they don't know have to call the custom info in France . Will speak with my vet on Saturday maybe he tell me more. Oh do I have to take him in the cage or he will be fine without it?

davemck3834 wrote:

*Karen* wrote:Also staffs are banned in some countries, ie Germany!
My geography is crap so I don't know if you would pass thru there or not!

For info apparently they are not banned in Germany , it seems to possibly be a district thing and I think about import of staffies, I was surprised as I thought the same but we had a german breeder say hello a few months ago and I've since found another one

The import of staffs & some other bull breeds is banned in Germany, although they are still bred & kept there.

"Staffordshire bull terriers are not on the list of dangerous dogs in France. An answer to a Parliamentary question put to the Ministère de l’Intérieur (Home Office), published in the Official Journal dated 5 February 2001 (page 774), confirms the amendment to the list published in the decree of 27 April 1999, and excludes Staffordshire bull terriers from the said list."
Found on french embassy web

it's very unlikely you be allow to take your staffy in Germany

jola139 wrote:"Staffordshire bull terriers are not on the list of dangerous dogs in France. An answer to a Parliamentary question put to the Ministère de l’Intérieur (Home Office), published in the Official Journal dated 5 February 2001 (page 774), confirms the amendment to the list published in the decree of 27 April 1999, and excludes Staffordshire bull terriers from the said list."
Found on french embassy web

No, they are not on the list. However, they only allow pure bred staffordshire bull terriers in the country - no cross breeds, so you may have to prove that your dog is pure bred. The only proof that the french will accept is the KC registration document.

Caryll wrote: no cross breeds, so you may have to prove that your dog is pure bred. The only proof that the french will accept is the KC registration document.

Do you mean only Staffs?

Sorry, I mean no bull breed crosses. Only pure bred staffs/ebts etc.

So any other cross breed would be fine?

Yes, as long as they don't look like bull breed crosses!

So I have no chance of taking Moo abroad then? the vet didn't mention it when I asked

why would you want to go aboard anyway?

Cause I love the sun, I'd love a change and it may be a an opportunity career wise for me in the future, I would like to able to have the option. Doesn't seem so though

No hardship, Norfolk it is!

janey wrote:So I have no chance of taking Moo abroad then? the vet didn't mention it when I asked

Depends where you want to go (I think Spain & Italy are ok) and whether you're unlucky enough to be questioned about her breed. Not all dogs will be checked, other than their passports, but some will be. As far as I'm aware Scandinavia have no restrictions, either.

Just did a bit of googling - Spain doesn't like them either.

So how many get through and what happens when they don't?

Totally diffferent thing but I ship a lot of paintings, some get held up in customs, some don't? Some have been held for 6 weeks, some have taken 5 days to get there, a lucky dip!

It isn't something I would risk now, shame, but when I spoke to the vets about going to Europe they never mentioned a problem?

If you get found out, you'll be turned back. So you'd have to go home.

I don't know the percentages of who gets stopped & who doesn't.

I would think that vets know what vaccinations are needed for a pet passport, but you can't expect them to be up to date on travel arrangements & each country's laws.

OMG. I just realised I've stuck up for a vet!

European passports are now standard, so I am informed.

So do you think the vets is right or would travelling with Moo be a no go?

Caryll, you have worried me

why are you even thinking going aboard > we got all what we need in the uk

Yes,we've got everything exept the weather
Ok,so I wrote to French an German embassy,still waiting for the reply from French but this is german reply
"The breed staffordshire bull terrier is regarded as dangerous in Germany and importation is not allowed.
But to avoid difficulties in passenger traffic, exceptions from the importation and introduction prohibit shall be allowed.

According to this, the importation or introduction prohibit does not apply to dangerous dogs carried along by persons who stay in the Federal Republic of Germany for up to four weeks (this especially applies to tourists) - provided that the dog keeper can submit the documents required for the verification of the pets (e.g. certificate of descent/origin, vaccination certificate, certificate of the personality test, other certificates issued by the competent public affairs office).

For further questions about the introduction of dangerous dogs, please contact the competent public affairs office (Ordnungamt) of the Federal State via which you enter Germany.

For legal reasons this information can only be given to the best of our knowledge and is not legally binding.

Yours sincerely,

Katja Laars"
I think I will try get some info from euro tunel people,live in Folkestone soo it's handy

jola139 wrote:
provided that the dog keeper can submit the documents required for the verification of the pets (e.g. certificate of descent/origin, vaccination certificate, certificate of the personality test, other certificates issued by the competent public affairs office).

I read this as a requirement of the pedigree certificate , but you have no papers for the dog , is that correct ?? Not trying to discourage you , but you really must make sure you are covered so you don't ruin your holiday

Those are eg vaccination certificate, certificate of the personality test etc

jola139 wrote:Those are eg vaccination certificate, certificate of the personality test etc

I refer to "certificate of descent/origin" this to me is the pedigree certificate to prove the dog is a full staff and not a xbreed

jola139 wrote:According to this, the importation or introduction prohibit does not apply to dangerous dogs carried along by persons who stay in the Federal Republic of Germany for up to four weeks (this especially applies to tourists) - provided that the dog keeper can submit the documents required for the verification of the pets (e.g. certificate of descent/origin, vaccination certificate, certificate of the personality test, other certificates issued by the competent public affairs office).

The certificate of descent/origin is the registration certificate of a kc registered dog. The french (if you are challenged) will insist on this & will not accept any other form of documentation to prove that your dog is a Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

You don't have a registration document & so you could, possibly, have a problem. You may not - you may never be asked to show his details at all (apart from the usual pet passport stuff), but you could be, and if you are you could be turned back & will have to go home.

Just a warning.

Hi we take Olly to France all the time ,he is full staffie but we dont have KC ,so we asked the french vet what to do he told us to get a letter off a show judge or english vet stating in their opinion Olly was a pure bred staffie ,we got the letter we also have his breeders pedigree 5 gen ,we have been there and back and are going again in 2 weeks never had any problems with police gendarmes etc in fact we get stopped by people saying how gorgeous he is! also have staffordshire bull terrier on his passport ,as amstaffs are def banned eg pitbulls!

As we live in France 7 months of the year ,i can tell you the only staffies that are on any ddl are pitbulls or amstaffs, there are lots of english and french owned staffies,also staffie crosses are advertised in french dog rescues a friend of ours has 2 staffie crosses and has never had a problem ,do not listen to all the uninformed comments ask the ferry company ,we went through all this 7 years ago when we took harry and louis to france the first time ,both staffie crosses no problems with the french( only stupid english people) our friend was the deputy mayor who was also a chief of police

harlou wrote:Hi we take Olly to France all the time ,he is full staffie but we dont have KC ,so we asked the french vet what to do he told us to get a letter off a show judge or english vet stating in their opinion Olly was a pure bred staffie ,we got the letter we also have his breeders pedigree 5 gen ,we have been there and back and are going again in 2 weeks never had any problems with police gendarmes etc in fact we get stopped by people saying how gorgeous he is! also have staffordshire bull terrier on his passport ,as amstaffs are def banned eg pitbulls!

If that's all you need, then that's great. It's just the only info I could find said that the French would only accept a KC registration form as proof of whether or not the dog is pure staff. If they'll accept the letter etc, then that's all to the good.

I hope you have a fantastic trip & a really good time . When do you go?

harlou wrote:As we live in France 7 months of the year ,i can tell you the only staffies that are on any ddl are pitbulls or amstaffs, there are lots of english and french owned staffies,also staffie crosses are advertised in french dog rescues a friend of ours has 2 staffie crosses and has never had a problem ,do not listen to all the uninformed comments ask the ferry company ,we went through all this 7 years ago when we took harry and louis to france the first time ,both staffie crosses no problems with the french( only stupid english people) our friend was the deputy mayor who was also a chief of police

Harlou , these are not uninformed comments these are facts...

From French authorities, nobody says they are not allowed. They say that these rules MAY be enforced. So you've had a good experience and no problems. This is just how it is for you. We must advise our members on facts not experiences and then they can choose to take the gambles if appropriate. Also am I correct in saying your experiences are only in France . When this lady has a clear defined statement about the standing in Germany, pardon my geography , but without taking a long detour you still have to pass through Germany to get to Poland.

Facts are to guarantee no problems from French or German authorities
1) You must have a Pet Passport
2) You must carry registration papers to prove your dog is a full staff.

If you cannot prove your dog is a full staff, then the authorities (IN France and I assume Germany is the same but this is unknown) have the right to assume they MAY be crossed with a dog on the DDL and this is where the problem lies .

Pedigree Staffs are not a banned breed in France
Pedigree Staffs are allowed to travel through Germany , though they are not allowed to stay when originating from another country

@ Harlou , Sorry I have just seen the other post from Caryll and yourself, and now I am extremely interested as we wanted to go to France for our holidays but Tilly has no papers.
Is it possible you have some kind of document stating these facts about the showjudge or vet.
I would like some contact details of the person so we may write to them and get official clarification of this (or maybe you could do this from your Chief of Police friend or someone ???) You would be doing our members a big favour.
I remember seeing your post before regarding this and thought to myself I would rather base my chances on facts rather than experience , but if this is correct then it is certainly worth pursuing as quite a few other members have asked and failed for the same problems

Go on Anglo info france into forum and type either staffies or staffordshire bull terriers all the info is there there are the official ammendments etc to the french dangerous dogs bill we downloaded them and carried them but never needed them ,we have taken our dogs all over france and never had a problem ,the ones most helpful were the ferry companies ,we go again a week monday ,its raining there as well

@ HARLOU , I dont know if your french is better than mine but I had a quick look at the forum and only see english information stating what we have already said , the rest is in french , is it possible you could provide a link here with the relevant information on so I can look into it

Thanks

My French is Geordie french so its crap but the french like it,im not very good with computers links etc ,go on the french embassy website its in english type in staffordshire bull terrier that gives you all the info you need in english ,as long as your dogs passport says staffordshire bull terrier you are ok ,on the staffie to france gowen there is a reply from the french ministry to the same question and it clearlly states staffordshire bull terriers are not classed as dangerous! yet again ask Brittany ferries as they are not allowed to carry any dangerous dogs

It's still all very confusing and clear as mud , I have emailed Defra for an answer , also seems a lot of these posts around the internet are from 2007

So we are planing to go in August ,we've got the passport. The vet told us to contact the euro tunnel people on the French side. There is no border in Germany so no one will check us it's only France . Defra didn't give me any info,told me to contact French embassy. Will contact the euro tunnel next week and will keep you post it.