Teeth and gum problem

A couple months ago our 3 year old girl was suffering from bad breath and a closer check revealed she had something that looked like a piece of bark from a stick lodged inside her gum right behind her largest tooth on one side. The vet removed this and prescribed a course of antibiotics, claiming it was all fixed when we checked a week later.

Over the last few days the bad breath was back and when I looked there was a build up of something that is seeping out of the gum in the exactly the same place and it looks a little swollen. I've just taken her to the vet who prescribed another course of the same antibiotics that we used last time.

The vet says that we'll check again at the end of this course but it's possible a biopsy may have to be performed under general anaesthetic to cut away at that gum and see if there is anything inside which is causing the infection to return. I am a little concerned that digging into the gum area like that will weaken that major tooth and just wondered if others have any thoughts or had any experience with this sort of thing? She is showing no signs of discomfort but I would like to get this successfully resolved, so it doesn't become a recurring problem.

This is Bailey watching TV recently:

I'd go by what the vet says - if there's anything left under the gum it will continue to fester & should be got rid of asap.

On the other hand it may be that the original infection hadn't quite been eradicated & the new course of antibiotics will clear it.

We'll have to see how it progresses and obviously I have to listen to the vet's advice. I wonder at the moment if this antibiotic is strong enough to do the trick given that it has come back in the same place and there is no sign of anything obvious being stuck inside there. Rather than performing a biopsy immediately perhaps an x-ray would be the first logical step after this course of medicine.

I suppose it depends how the antibiotics go? Either way (biopsy or x ray) it'll be a full anaesthetic. Maybe the vet feels that if he x rays & there's something there, he's gonna have to go in anyway, so why not do that straight away?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not particularly supporting the vet - they're not all brilliant, just wondering why he wants to take that course of action. Did he explain?

The vet wants to see how it heals over the next week but immediately suggested we do a biopsy to see what could be beneath the gum, given that it has returned in the same place. She seems to suspect there is something lodged inside there that is causing the infection to reoccur. She also said we would have to run the course of antibiotics anyway before undertaking any surgery, so it sounds like she has already made up her mind that the biopsy will be required.

I can't help but feeling that if the infection came back after the last course of antibiotics maybe we should have been trying something stronger this time and possibly avert the need for an anaesthetic and minor surgery in a week or two. If it looks good in 7 days time do we assume it's fixed or still go ahead with surgery that may not even find anything?

looking at her teeth there is some kind of hardened crystallised like substance about the size of a large pinhead coming out of her gum so I know that isn't right but it doesn't seem to be causing her any discomfort. She is eating fine and still chewing bones like before plus her general mood is fine. In two to three days it will almost certainly be all clear from a visual point of view but I hope this time we can resolve it properly. At least with an x-ray they can check before cutting.

ashleyk wrote:looking at her teeth there is some kind of hardened crystallised like substance about the size of a large pinhead coming out of her gum so I know that isn't right but it doesn't seem to be causing her any discomfort. She is eating fine and still chewing bones like before plus her general mood is fine. In two to three days it will almost certainly be all clear from a visual point of view but I hope this time we can resolve it properly. At least with an x-ray they can check before cutting.

Trouble is, staffords are notorious for not showing pain & discomfort till it's REALLY bad. Bandit walked around for probably a week or more with a fractured elbow before he even started limping, and another few days before he started to whimper a little.

I don't know, maybe the vet really suspects that there's definitely something there & wants to clean it out, but needs to control the infection first?

Our dogs certainly give us plenty to worry about, don't they?

I know staffies are ridiculously tough but hopefully this antibiotic will at least bring the infection under control quickly and lessen any discomfort, however if there is something lodged deep inside it's possible that has been causing pain without our knowing for the last two months. Her breath has only started to smell more over the last few days though, so I think this is more recent. I just hope we can do this the right way and quickly.

The vet explained that the configuration of teeth in staffies is rather different than most other breeds and that they are somewhat prone to problems like this. Bailey loves to play with sticks in the woods and at the beach so it would be very easy for a splinter to fix itself inside the gum while chewing.

Bailey went back to the vet last night and there is still some sign of the problem. After further examination we believe this is most likely the indirect result of her jaw being slightly misaligned giving her an uneven bite.

Her large canine tooth on the bottom left hand side has actually made a dent in the roof of her mouth and although there is no sign of problems in that area it is right next to where the infections are occurring on the gum and the vet now believes the misaligned formation of her teeth could be compacting food and other substances into that area of gum just behind a small tooth, making it susceptible to infections.

The game plan at the moment is for me to start using a special dog friendly antiseptic tooth gel, which will hopefully keep that area clean to avoid infection and this will become a daily job. If that works then the problem can be contained but otherwise we will be forced to remove the smaller tooth at the top of her mouth. This would create a larger space, so there won't be the same concentrated pressure on that area of gum.

That's an inverted canine. A common problem in Bull Terriers (Dempsey has one), but I've not heard of it too much in staffords. There are a couple of solutions; the one your vet is sugesting now, although that may mean doing it for life, extraction of the tooth, or filing the top of the tooth down so that it doesn't make contact with the roof of the mouth.

The original vet from the RSPCA talked about filing down the lower canine or possibly removing it completely if it becomes a problem and he was due to take care of this while she was being spayed in early February, however he couldn't make up his mind on the best solution, so he decided to do nothing and just wait to see if anything happened later on. There was no sign of any infections at the time or any other pain, so this was probably a reasonable decision at that point.

The vet yesterday said we should do everything possible to avoid either of these options with that canine. When you file down a tooth you effectively leave it exposed and weakened, while removing it completely apparently leaves the tongue hanging out at times and also means the dog lacks a good grip, remembering that dogs tend to use their mouths much like we use our hands.

The suggestion that we remove that smaller tooth above is probably easier and less likely to cause problems later on, however, I hope we can contain the problem with daily cleaning. Bailey's jaw is quite heavily overshot and this is what has brought on the wry jaw from what I have just read here http://dogs.about.com/cs/disableddogs/p/malocclusion.htm

This could be something that has happened naturally I suppose but it's quite pronounced and I wonder if she was encouraged to hang on to things or play tug of war when she was a puppy before her jaw was properly formed. We are her third owners so we have no way of knowing what went on when she was a puppy.

On the subject of bull terriers I've noticed that all the bullies I've seen of late have a less egg shaped head than they had a few years ago and I gather it was going too far before in some cases. Bailey often plays with a huge and wonderfully docile bullie called Wolfie who is a good 80 pounds in weight. He can't keep up with our girl for speed or stamina but he has the most fantastically calm temperament you could ever wish for. Bailey has just reached 3 years old so we are coming out of the adolescent stage where they can sometimes be difficult or unpredictable in certain situations.

I think its happened of its own accord as undershot mouths sometimes have problems like this you can only go with the vets advice and dental hygene is a must so ur doin all ytou can to help

Overshot or undershot jaws are not caused by tug of war play when young - it's a genetic thing, same as inverted canines.

Bandit lost one of his canines (my OH's fault - he was throwing stones into the river wye for Bandit to catch, and he caught a big un & broke his tooth down to the gum) and his tongue never hung out of the side, in fact it never seemed to bother him at all!

Some Bullies' heads were (and still are) too exagerrated. Some look more like a parrot from the side! The standard calls for a smooth ovoid shape, not a huge parrot beak, but some people like it. I think most of the breeders are moving away from that exagerration as far as poss.

I am quite reassured by your comments and seems that the tooth problem need not be that serious. The antiseptic gel has just arrived at the vets today so I shall pop up there shortly and then we shall begin the daily treatments.

A part of me likes the rounded down face on some bullies but I can remember seeing some cases that were definitely on the extreme side and could only be the result of very specific breeding and I think I heard it was causing some breathing problems.

The bull terrier is a fine breed of dog with terrific charisma and a wonderful sense of humour. As with all types of dog though common sense has to be used in breeding or problems will occur. I recently saw some images of English bulldogs that I personally found rather disturbing http://www.securitykennel.com/buldoguematrizes.html

Yes, I don't like exagerrations. The Bulldog has been ruined beyond repair to be honest, what exactly are they fit for now?

Funnily enough, the one thing bull terriers don't seem to suffer from is breathing problems, even with the 'parrot' heads. They do, however, sometimes have problems with picking things up off the floor etc (toys/treats/food) because their nostrils extend so far past their jaw line. The less exagerrated ones aren't so bad.

The worse thing is the amount of hereditary problems (not that many compared to some breeds, but still). Kidney/heart/patella/skin problems are quite common, but there are health tests for people wanting to breed, and most serious breeders take them up.