hunting/gun dog

So i live in the middle of hunting country, ducks, pheasant etc..., i have a year and a half old female staffy and she has a very calm and assertive personality and loves tagging along with her male retriever and lab friends, im being told by the men around here that shes not at all cut out for hunting, and Roxi and i would like to prove them wrong! any tips or ideas regarding this, she learns and listens very well and has a very good nose on her, and loves swimming, she is also very gently on toys and items that arent her typical rawhides and has never been one to play tug of war (ive heard that it promotes a heavy bite in the hunting world) . Im not a hunter myself quiet yet but frequently go out with friends or my boyfriend and would like to bring her along ......im always looking for ways to show that this breed can do what others doubt! any tips or stories of success with training your staff. for hunting or gun dog training? and personally im being laughed at by all the hunting dog owners out here and the best place i can ask would be a forum like this who have as much faith and patience in their staffy as i do!

Hi & welcome to the forum!

I'm probably not the best person to answer this cause I can't stand hunting!

All predators have some of the 5 prey instincts (stalk, chase, catch, kill, eat), but very few have all 5. Gun dogs instinctively have the first 3, but no more. Terriers often have the first 4, and sometimes all 5. If she does have the first 4, she'll be no good as a hunting dog because she'll worry the dead bird (or whatever) when she gets to it, and won't bring it back in one piece!

Is there anyways to find that out about that? and how she reacts to the animals with out having to kill something and learn the messy way in case she does have all 5?

I too thought mine would make a great beater but the problem is a Staff has the sense to chase and kill, but not always to retrieve. Also there jaw is generally too strong. They can retrieve things but not in the manner a working dog will.

I don't doubt that you couldn't train them too, and mine is a cross so she seems to have it in her.

Hi and welcome

nikkiluv8907 wrote:Is there anyways to find that out about that? and how she reacts to the animals with out having to kill something and learn the messy way in case she does have all 5?

Only by trial & error, I'm afraid. You could ask one of the hunters to help you to train her, but whether they'd agree or not is another matter.

thanks guys, well i have a guy around here who trains dogs on the side for hunting and does socialization classes, i will maybe give him a call and see if we can "test" the water and see if shes even interested! I know regardless she needs a hobby, there aren't a whole lot of things out here where i live for staffy and bully breeds. i wish there was agility courses, she seemed to love those when we went to the local shelter.......were keeping options open!

What about obedience training classes? Or even Working Trials?

You could even set up your own agility course if you have room & challenge the hunting dogs to do better than the staff!

Personally dont think staffies have a 'soft' enough mouth. Retrievers etc are specially bred to simply hold the prey. I know Tyson will without a doubt destroy! He already does a good demo job with tennis balls.

maybe you should get a pheasant from one of the guys and play fetch with it and see how gentle she is with the bird ,, failing her being able to retrieve i rekon staffs would do a great job on the beating side flushing the quarry out

niff wrote:failing her being able to retrieve i rekon staffs would do a great job on the beating side flushing the quarry out

Yes, but the flushers aren't supposed to chase the birds etc & try to kill them!

whats to say the dog will ?

I'm sure it's possible, but probably harder than with breeds that are bred for the purpose. If you want to I'd say go for it, though! You may or may not succeed, but I'm sure you will have some fun (and some frustration) and get to know your dog even better. Hunting dogs are generally trained with methods I'm no fan of, and that I wouldn't expect to work very well with a breed like the staffy. I'd check out this book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Positive-Gun-Dogs-Clicker-Training/dp/1890948330/ref=sr_1_sc_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1319214851&sr=8-1-spell

I don't have the book, as I'm not training gun dogs, but I've heard good reviews of it. It's supposed to be particularly good dealing with the retrieve aspect. If you want some input on the more general concept of training dogs that are seen as more "stubborn" etcetera (not my experience with the staff at all so far) I'd also recommend the book "When Pigs Fly" http://www.amazon.co.uk/When-Pigs-Fly-Training-Impossible/dp/1929242441/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1319215385&sr=1-1 it could probably help with ways to look at the training along the way. I don't have this one either, but I want it! Just discovered that there is a kindle edition so I think I'm going to get it right now!

When Pigs Fly is a great book. I got it when Dempsey made himself at home here & it gave me some small measure of comfort that he isn't the only blockhead around!

janey wrote:

I too thought mine would make a great beater but the problem is a Staff has the sense to chase and kill, but not always to retrieve. Also there jaw is generally too strong. They can retrieve things but not in the manner a working dog will.

I don't doubt that you couldn't train them too, and mine is a cross so she seems to have it in her.

Hi and welcome

That will be the terrier they have in them.

I think that staffs would be good for chasing rabbits, squirrels and moles.

if you check the local trianing centre they may have classed for it. ours does

...........just don't know why anyone wants to send dogs out to flush birds etc out to be killed, or to retrieve birds etc that have already been killed.

As you may have guessed, I'm not a huntin' shootin' fishin' type. I loath hunting, I'm afraid.

Caryll wrote:...........just don't know why anyone wants to send dogs out to flush birds etc out to be killed, or to retrieve birds etc that have already been killed.

As you may have guessed, I'm not a huntin' shootin' fishin' type. I loath hunting, I'm afraid.

Good, tasty, free range and free food is why.
Also the thrill of you against nature.

You against nature? You mean your gun & dogs against nature!

Whatever floats your boat.

Caryll wrote:You against nature? You mean your gun & dogs against nature!

Whatever floats your boat.

Yep.

Less cruel than industrial style farming used for meat production imo.
The animals lived as the were meant to.
Just my two cents.

at the end of the day hunting /gathering is as old as the human race , if we werent so intellegent we would all be doing it to eat and survive today but as an intellegent race we developed farming as an easier way of obtaining our meat .
for me i see no difference between someone going out and shooting a rabbit for the pot and a butcher at the slaughterhouse firing a bolt into a cows skull . infact the rabbit has a better chance of survival . the cow has nowhere to hide .

I think that too many are taken from the wild and most have little or no respect for it ie when and how to hunt. makes me sick to be honest and thats my 2 penneth. Nothing worse than a big guy with a pack of dogs in the full camis poaching on wildlife that has enough of a struggle to survive as it is

Staffy wrote:Less cruel than industrial style farming used for meat production imo.
The animals lived as the were meant to.
Just my two cents.

I don't approve of modern farming methods either!

gem wrote:I think that too many are taken from the wild and most have little or no respect for it ie when and how to hunt. makes me sick to be honest and thats my 2 penneth. Nothing worse than a big guy with a pack of dogs in the full camis poaching on wildlife that has enough of a struggle to survive as it is

Exactly.

gem wrote:I think that too many are taken from the wild and most have little or no respect for it ie when and how to hunt. makes me sick to be honest and thats my 2 penneth. Nothing worse than a big guy with a pack of dogs in the full camis poaching on wildlife that has enough of a struggle to survive as it is

Exactly.[/quote]

Well your not meant to use more then two dogs.Hardly a pack imo.

It is illegal for a person to hunt a wild mammal with a dog. Wild mammals include foxes, hares and deer.

I see nothing wrong with hunting rats and rabbits with dogs.
The Hunt is cruel imo If foxes are a problem they should be killed humanly.

Many animals are bred and released thus raising the stock.If it were not for these animals being bred for shooting etc then there would be little or no stock.

Rabbits are a pest introduced by the Romans as a food source and are harmful to the balance flora and fauna.
These should be hunted imo.Good source of food and your doing the area a favour.

pheasants were also introduced as a food source.Not sure on this but think they originate from the south America's.
Same as the rabbits above should be shot and eaten.

Also there strict laws on hunting and big penalty's if these laws are broken.
Example for poaching rabbits you can be extradited to Australia.

I met a guy that had a 'Ratter' a little terrier thing and he worked it on a farm. Amazing thing, got 26 rats in one sitting. What a star IMO anyway x

janey wrote:

I met a guy that had a 'Ratter' a little terrier thing and he worked it on a farm. Amazing thing, got 26 rats in one sitting. What a star IMO anyway x

I wonder why they don't use dogs in city's for rat control come to think of it?.....

True, I lived in London once, inner city not the suberbs and was disgusted by the rats round the pubs bins (I was running pubs at the time) I guess people don't want to see it, dogs killing them I mean, but they can do an amazing job! This little thing with attitude! x

janey wrote:

True, I lived in London once, inner city not the suberbs and was disgusted by the rats round the pubs bins (I was running pubs at the time) I guess people don't want to see it, dogs killing them I mean, but they can do an amazing job! This little thing with attitude! x

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxQksEF2uso&feature=related
I love the way the dogs are so happy.

Not really what I ment, those rats appear to be planted there. Or maybe its just me?

janey wrote:

Not really what I ment, those rats appear to be planted there. Or maybe its just me?

Farms where feed is stored can Have thousands of rats!

I suppose the one I met was a real working dog, it was the handlers living and that clip makes it look like a game.

i used to do some lamping with the lurchers years ago , as long as you had the land owners permission you could take , deer , hare , rabbit , never took a fox ( wouldnt eat one) also had 5 ferrets in my teens that caught me a load of dinners .

anyhoo this posts going to be never ending pro hunting, anti hunting will live forever .

niff wrote:i used to do some lamping with the lurchers years ago , as long as you had the land owners permission you could take , deer , hare , rabbit , never took a fox ( wouldnt eat one) also had 5 ferrets in my teens that caught me a load of dinners .

anyhoo this posts going to be never ending pro hunting, anti hunting will live forever .

True.

My other half is training one of ours to be a working dog, we've got two and the other dog just doesn't have it in him. He's not interested at all. I think it depends on the dog (not that I'm an expert - just what I've picked up on with my other half). The dog he's training has always shown an interest in following the scent of other animals so when he walks her he encourages her to run in woods and through hedges, every walk he comes back and she's got a pheasant or two up. Becauses ours is still young I don't think she's be any good at beating - she gets too excited ha ha

You are awsome omgosh. I have a 3 1/2 year old staffy that was 10 months old when I met his mom he was very uneducated very aggressive and scared, bad combo there. And she knew I've trained dogs most of my 49 years living on a farm and ranch of my family's, she asked me to train him and I did he is the most loving and kindness dog I have ever had and i trained him like a K9 dog is trained and now he absolutely minds like one. And he is an absolute freak for squirrel hunting and I mean like you pay for a hunting guide to take you squirrel hunting type of freak. He will hear them and takes off in that direction when we are hunting them he will scent them and find the tree it is in and I do the rest. He will "Bring it" as is his command for give it to me. Like a good retriever. He has a supper soft mouth also. So yes they can and do make good hunting dogs. My staffy no has been on several waterfowl hunts and when he hears duck and geese he will look up in the sky for them. He even retrieves my decoys for me. But hasn't retrieved a bird yet, I wanted to waite and see if he would take to it. We'll last week we went camping by the river, like 20 feet from our heads, and a her mallard land right in front of him and he went after it and leaped and dove into the water after her but I stopped him because she had a clutch of babies. So ya they can hunt if trained properly. They have really good noses too. I know this post was some time ago and I hope it worked out for you two, what a treat I hope you are In for.

Battle Mountain Forge.

Mine hunts and retrieves and his mouth is very soft he will hold my finder tip between his canines so very gently.

Hi & welcome.

Your dog sounds well trained (non-aversive training I hope) but I will never agree with hunting unless it's for food. Personally, even when I used to eat meat, I would never eat a squirrel!

My staffy pretty much will do anything for treats. He is very food motivated. And we eat everything we catch or hunt. It saves us alot of money in meat especially when you have two sons 17- 19 y. And to be honest I do not enjoy killing anything even fish, but it is something that my sons and including my 82 yr old father. This is how we feed our family save money and the meat is good and healthier for you and we all bond during this time. And to be even more honest the little red squirrels here and pretty good eating..