Troubling Times

I haven't been on here much in the past month or so. I have been having some issues with Nita that are starting to impact our relationship a bit.

It all started when I went with a friend to visit my sister who has a little pup. Some of you may have seen the video when I asked if Nita was being aggressive or just rough housing with the pooch. Well, we were all sat in the front room, the two dogs together and again they started rough housing. My brother in law started getting annoyed and said that Nita was being aggressive. I pointed out that they were just being rough (the pup kept coming back and nipping Nita on the ears and mouth and Nita would then stand over the puppy and mouth its scruff. No injuries apart from soaking wet fur from all the saliva.

The next minute, my bro in law got off the sofa and grabbed Nita by her collar and lifted her up off the floor and carted her out of the front room, into the kitchen and put her outside. Naturally I followed shouting to him to let her go (she was hung from her collar, feet and body off the floor). It all kicked off from there. My Staffy was aggressive, their puppy is now petrified of her, vet bills, etc etc. The whole gamut.

Suffice to say, my little nephew was the one who got us all back talking and the pooches carried on playing.

Cut to two weeks later and my friend and me are in a forested area with Nita, noone around, throwing ball for her.
The ball gets lost in a thorny hedgerow along the side of the track we are walking on so we all go look for it. Next thing, I turn round and 50ft away is a lass on horseback. Didn't hear her at all. I ask her if her horse is ok with dogs, she says yes. Nita, not seeing a horse before, goes up and stares at it and then starts barking. The horse panics and starts spinning around with Nita running around the horse barking. I couldn't get near to get her away and at one point I'm about 3ft away from the horses bum. The girl starts panicking and asks me what she should do. Stay calm, says I but unfortunately she didn't. She tries to get off and as the horse spins round, she falls off. With the the horse bolted with Nita running after her.

They reach the end of the track which leads onto a country road ands away they go, I run after them shouting to Nita but they are off and away. Luckily an old couple stop in their car and offer me a lift (they see whats happened) and we go after them. We finally catch up and I see Nita running alongside the left of the horse, dash underneath it and get hit and bowled over. She then decides to stop and go back the way she came. The couple ask if I want to go back after her but I decided it was more important to catch the horse before it gets hurt plus I knew my friend would get hold of Nita when they met.

So, away we go. two miles late or so we manage to stop the horse on another country lane and a car passing stops and points out they have horses so will take care of it, we go back to find the girl but she is nowhere in sight.
My friend has got hold of Nita, I get out and check on her. Thankfully all she had was a scuff below her eye and a torn nail in the back leg.
We head back to the car and 10 mins later a white van pulls up. Uh oh, thinks I. Here we go. The chap asks if we have just had a run in with a horse. Yes, says I. Well your dog has bitten the horse, he says. No she never, said I, least not when I saw them both and she would have had a hard job doing it at full gallop, however I explain I would pay vet bills if the horse has injured itself by bolting

Anyway, we swap details and away we go. Two hours later I get a phone call from the police. Oh jeez. SO we venture down to the police station with Nita. I explain what happened but apparently the girl on the horse said Nita had bitten the horse on its genitals and stomach and hind leg. I flatly deny that as she didn't when I was with them both.
Cut a long story short again, turns out their vet said the marks were consistent with dog puncture wounds. Hmm, it was a very thorny area we were in but nevertheless to refrain from going to court I get in touch with my pet insurance and they confirm they would pay out even if there were no injuries merely because Nita chased the horse.

Now, since the sister incident she has become more snappy with other dogs and unfortunately today she and a retriever had a go at each other. The dog (both off lead) came towards Nita, Nita snapped and the dog backed off. Nita barked at it and away they went. The other dog was bleeding from the edge of her ear and Nita has a cut on her back. Now through all of this I remained calm so as not to get both dogs excited more, the other guy launches a boot and kicks Nita. To be fair I let that go as Nita started it.

So, its been a hellish few weeks. Although, she happily plays with a bunch of other dogs with no problem.

My question being, I am thinking of muzzling her for her own protection rather than other dogs per se what with the image a staffy gets. Problem is she is a ball freak and loves running after them and pinching other pooch friends balls too.

Any suggestions?

Wow mate. What a few weeks!
The incident with the pup doesn't sound like it was anything to do with Nita, more like someone not understanding our breed.
As far as the horse incident the only thing I can think of is a long line and unfortunately avoiding the areas where horses go. We tried to introduce Theia to them through a fence, she was ok at first but then had a bark at them. You're going to have to be super aware of them from now on.
The fight could be just one of those things, especially as she plays so well with the others.
Basically, I'm trying to give you reasons not to muzzle her.
You're doing great with her, I'd give her another chance.
Oh! And not having a spare ball is a schoolboy error!
Pete.

Maybe a harness too, makes it much easier to grab them when needed.

Thanks Pete,
Yes I did point out that neither dog nor pup was being aggressive but I was told that just because I read a few lines about dogs I think I'm an expert lol. I still chuckle at that.

I did mention to the girl on the horse that she could have warned she was coming towards us. However, it was an old haunt in a different part of the country I used to take my GSD 15 odd years ago, never saw a horse then but suffice to say we wont be going back anytime soon. Went up to Brimham Rocks a few weeks ago and used a 15m training lead for her. Worked perfectly.

I think I am just concerned that she gets the blame all the time what with her being a staffy. She was playing happily with 3 other dogs beforehand, seems to be the retrievers she doesnt get on with.

Good point with the harness, also know someone who can get them made custom.

Wow! Yes, a crazy few weeks by the sounds of things. Is Nita a rescue, or have you had her from a pup? I can't remember, sorry!

I think your most useful tool would be a long line.. This way you can let her have her space, and chase her ball when the area that you exercise her in is quiet, but you still have control. What sort of an area do you live in? Could you walk her somewhere without so many other animals whilst you're still building your bond/training with her? Remember, quality socialization with dogs that you know is 100% more important than Nita meeting lots of dogs that you can't be sure she will get on with. A muzzle when meeting new dogs would be useful, definitely! Just be sure to take your time to get her used to it - very few dogs enjoy wearing a muzzle, most tolerate at best.

The initial encounter between the pup and Nita sounds like dogs just being dogs and happily playing. No pup would try and swing off the ear of a dog it was terrified of and Nita sounds like she pulled back her play. I am afraid it is your BiL who does not ‘get’ dog interactions who needs the Yellow Ribbon not the dogs.

Best thing to do with a bull terrier is to remember they all have the potential to go ‘squirral’, it does not matter what size the squirrel is, if it has huge horns, a rider on its back or even flies. If it is moving about and making noise you can bet your dog will suddenly think that is so much more fun to chase than paying attention to you. Trouble is the more they chase the more hyped the other animal becomes thus setting up a vicious circle.
In future with any farm animal stick Nita on a lead before going close. Keep your voice calm low key and simply walk past at a safe distance as if that animal is the most boring creature you have ever meet. If she is starting to get interested and become ‘alert’ aake yourself more interesting use the command ‘watch’. {best done with a treat in your hand waved under her nose then you bring the hand with the treat up to your face and point two fingers at your eye} Nita looks at you instead of locking in what I call the squirrel stance reward her with a treat or gently stroke her.

A long line made for a horse is your friend, it will give her freedom to explore and you something to hang on and if need be pull back in and shorten as you observe potential hazards. Use a good harness to attach a long line to as that will be less likely to cause Nita problems.
The chase episode will have left her buzzing and alert, after that kind of adrenalin surge it can take a dog 48-72 hours to begin to calm down from. If in that period they encounter other exciting things during that phase they simply hype back up again ready for action.
Use obedience and brain games to focus her back on you around your home and garden. Opt for times when it will be quieter to take her walking for a couple of days, calmly praise every single bit of calm good behaviour. Pretend to be deaf and blind to hyped staff but ouze happiness and pleasure at calm staff actions. Teach her to play ‘find’ with her ball or treats, there are plenty of ideas on the forum for stuck at home staffs.
If you have any dog savvy friends with dog friendly dogs maybe arrange to lead walk Nita with their dogs just till she remembers doggy manners.
Give all that a go and see if it helps diffuse her behaviour after such an urm exciting few days.
[And if it makes you feel any better I was walking Pink off lead in a Country Park she knows very well. 95% of the time she is as good as gold. Enter the muntjac, exit Pinky straight into the woodland bog. I spent 20 minutes fighting through thorns trying to get to the idiot creature to stop her chasing big squirrels with fangs and only caught up with her after she spent five minutes repeatedly head-butting a huge willow in her effort to make the squirrel she had seen run up it drop out. I was soaked, coated in mud and furious. She was black, smug and straight back on a lead for the rest of the walk. There is a reason most of the local dog walkers know my dogs name.]

I certainly wouldn't recommend muzzling, I don't see as you've described any behaviour that would require it. Your dog is just being a dog and not exhibiting any worrying signs. Muzzling her would put her in a vulnerable position and would impact negatively on her enjoyment.

You just need to keep an eye out for the unexpected and either have good recall or a long leash when it's possible someone might approach without you knowing, as mentioned. However, whereas admittedly you didn't have control of your dog in the forest, the girl didn't have any control over her horse and she is equally to blame, or more so IMO. I've seen more than one instance of someone who thought they can just take any old horse out in public, without any training, and then is surprised when something goes wrong (resulting in a fatality on one occasion). What's more it sounds like she didn't have a clue about how to control it. She should never have been riding it in the first place.

The dog bites sound very suspicious, too. If a Staffie is of a mind to attack a horse I'd expect it to hang on, not just bite and let go. Sounds like she's pulling a fast one and trying to divert blame from herself.

As for your brother-in-law... I'll stop there before I say anything else.

Poor Nita

Awww i really feel for you all. Iv had run ins with people and weve had nips to the ears etc by tiny dogs and never made a fuss but as soon as the staffy is over playful they are suddenly the nasty viscious dog! Its so unfair.

I unfortunately cant trust ours off lead just now and its hard work.

My question is a fully drown horse how the heck could nita have bitten the horse when it was galloping along. A horse is a powerful animal and thick skinned seems nita was the easy target to blame. I would follow the sensible advice given.

Blimey Al, you really have had a couple of bad weeks. I'm of the same opinion with the muzzle that I don't think she warrants it as she isn't showing consistent aggression in any way. The play fighting is simply that.

As for the horse episode, you weren't to know, however, if ever there is a chance that you might happen across one you have to be vigilant. We go to a couple of places where horse riding occurs and they can come from nowhere, you have to be quick and lead yer Staffy. If unsure then the long line is ideal.

Thanks guys, I appreciate the comments. Because she is a staffy, as we know, they always seem to get it in the neck, so to speak, and its always the staffy thats at 'fault'.

As for the horse incident, what annoyed me was that she came towards us, Nita was inbetween myself and my friend looking in the bushes. Had she (the rider) made us aware she was approaching I could have acted there and then as she was next to me.
I asked the same question to the officer, how could she have bitten under the horse when it was galloping. She certainly didn't do it when she was barking at the horse and it was spinning round. I'm 6'2 and the top of my head was eye level on the horse.

Cait, she runs around with other dogs no problem. I have a video of her in the diary section. It would seem that if she is with one other dog and another comes in and tries to join in the play she has a go. I am constantly watching her for signs she is going to snap and she shows none until the last second. I watch her that much I ignore the chats I have with the other dog walkers. I even point out where their dogs are if they lose sight of them.

After the horse issue, one of the walkers wrote a statement about Nita (this was in case the horse owners wanted to go to court). This is what she wrote (i've obviously taken out her address etc.



Made me proud.

Personally I don't think the rider should have been alone as an older more experienced rider would have shown her what to do in advance of her approach. Common sense says to let others know you are approaching, her lack of experience showing in asking you what she should do. Whenever I see riders they're always in twos and threes. You really need to work on your recall though, and have one eye on what's going on around "expect the unexpected" as they say. The adults that weren't there seem to be looking to clear themselves from blame even though they failed to be there as a roll model for the rider and horse.
As soon as a horse or anything other than a known person or dog appears you should call your dog to you and put them on the lead until you know things are fine or they've gone. I've seen a similar thing happen with a GSD that barked and chased a girl on a horse and nearly got a mouthful of hind foot as it was spooked. The owner had no control at all. As for the other business I'd say the other bloke was far too harsh and was asking for a mouthful himself, but it would seem he didn't trust your judgement or ability to control your dog and took the law into his own hands out of frustration. I'm sure you love your dog to bits etc., but love on its own isn't enough, for her sake and your own you must be more assertive and take control before things flare up rather than after. I hope things work out well and everything calms down. All the best. Ian.
ps. It's unfortunately true that dogs of certain breeds are treated as guilty until proven innocent and so whether we like it or not we have to go that extra mile to show ourselves as good as anyone else to get the same rights and treatment by others. We must fight against the image of status symbol, devil dog, and any thing else these people can throw at us with their one remaining brain cell until the penny finally drops and people blame the deed and not the breed.

Rachel33 wrote:Wow! Yes, a crazy few weeks by the sounds of things. Is Nita a rescue, or have you had her from a pup? I can't remember, sorry!

I think your most useful tool would be a long line.. This way you can let her have her space, and chase her ball when the area that you exercise her in is quiet, but you still have control. What sort of an area do you live in? Could you walk her somewhere without so many other animals whilst you're still building your bond/training with her? Remember, quality socialization with dogs that you know is 100% more important than Nita meeting lots of dogs that you can't be sure she will get on with. A muzzle when meeting new dogs would be useful, definitely! Just be sure to take your time to get her used to it - very few dogs enjoy wearing a muzzle, most tolerate at best.

Thanks Rachel. She is a rescue per se. She hadn't been looked after treatment wise for her demodectic mange and ear infection and it had been left for two years untreated by her previous owners (vet bills not paid etc). I've got a long line for her which I used when we went for another walk to Brimham Rocks (nature reserve type place) which worked great. I live in a little town surrounded by fields. The back of my place leads to an open field with walkways along the side of said field so there are plenty of places to take her. SHe gets plenty of socialization with her other doggy friends. Usually between 2-12 other dogs off lead and playing happily. In fact through this interaction she is learning that leaving her ball means it gets thrown for her to run after (she always kept hold of it). I spoke with a chap  who is an ex dog warden who has two dogs Nita plays with and he said she doesn't need a muzzle.
It seems to be a case of her just not liking certain dogs which just about all dogs, I imagine, go through. I guess her being a Staffy too just makes it that bit more of an issue to people. But on the whole, folk have been very positive about her.