Day 8 (jealousy issues)

Morning all, stress is an understatement. We've been keeping the play sessions short and sweet. Kenny has been really good with lilly, but he did frighten me last night. He's becoasming jealous when lilly is around me. I avoid fussing her, i just pick her up to move her from Kenny when she starts biting. I do have a snuggle, but only when Kenny goes out Carl. Last night, she bit his face again, but this time the growl and nudge was quite aggressive, to the point Carl had to pull him away, and shout, Lilly was pushed up against the couch, on her back and he was holding her down and growling . I do feel we made a mistake shouting at Kenny, but his behaviour was very worrying. I think we've pushed everything backwards. This morning, they played a little, and Kenny played tug with her, he was growling while playing (playfull growl). He started to get a bite dominant, and Lilly bit him again. His reaction was better, just a little growl, but i removed her. I think what i should of done was not remove her, but see if she got the message from Ken. Im a bag of nerves, Help

Im no much help for you but i would like to see a pic of them both together playing tug or something

I still have no experience with this so can't be of much help, can send a >< for you though Kelly

Sure someone will be along shortly with some advice .. in the mean time, don't worry for what was done last night - it is done, you all lived through it and today is a whole new day

Aww Kelly I'm sure Dave will be able to offer you some advice, sorry I can't help, they will pick up on your nerves though so try to stay calm.

I just let them deal with stuff by themselves. Unless it looked like Sierra would get hurt. I didn't want to keep stopping and starting them unless really needed! The first night we thought Bailey was going to kill Sierra but just letting them get on with it helped!

Also kennd ,

I have a keen interest in your dog from your avatar,it really is a beauitfull looking staffy its perfect

Could you if its no bother post up some pics of him,would love to see his whole body

Aww sorry to hear of all the nerves! It must be a horrible feeling. Ive no experience either, but I hope it all gets better!

Aww your poor nerves, sure everything will be ok Hugs X

Kelly , I won't pretend to be in the same situation as I'm not , Tilly has been the underdog in most stuff since Tommy came as he is a bossy little britches. Tilly will stand up to him outside and play as rough as he does , in the house she lets him rule the roost and we don't stand in the way unless he steals food from her mouth or pushes her away from her food , then we take him away.
If you do think Kenny is telling him off then let him do it , did you watch POG last night with the Blue Staff pup and the old girl (Lola i think her name was ??) just putting the 2 together letting flipper do his stuff and allowing Lola to chastise him really seemed to have taught a few manners. Obviously never let them be alone together at this stage but Kenny has got to be allowed to show her he's the boss. With the jealousy bit you have to keep it separate as I think we've got 2 different issues going on here , Kenny needs some time to adjust and he will learn long time , but Lilly also has to learn her boundaries.

Whatever happens generally 1 dog will assume the position of boss , I think in most cases it will be the established dog , for me it worked out a little differently

Dave wrote:Kelly , I won't pretend to be in the same situation as I'm not , Tilly has been the underdog in most stuff since Tommy came as he is a bossy little britches. Tilly will stand up to him outside and play as rough as he does , in the house she lets him rule the roost and we don't stand in the way unless he steals food from her mouth or pushes her away from her food , then we take him away.
If you do think Kenny is telling him off then let him do it , did you watch POG last night with the Blue Staff pup and the old girl (Lola i think her name was ??) just putting the 2 together letting flipper do his stuff and allowing Lola to chastise him really seemed to have taught a few manners. Obviously never let them be alone together at this stage but Kenny has got to be allowed to show her he's the boss. With the jealousy bit you have to keep it separate as I think we've got 2 different issues going on here , Kenny needs some time to adjust and he will learn long time , but Lilly also has to learn her boundaries.

Whatever happens generally 1 dog will assume the position of boss , I think in most cases it will be the established dog , for me it worked out a little differently

thanks dave, they've been ok since, kenny still warns her off, but hasnt reacted in the same way as last night. I proberly looked to much into it to. Im making an extra fuss of kenny, just in case, i also make sure me and ken get time alone too. I'll take some pics and another video. Thank you so much ))))

Broxi wrote:Also kennd ,

I have a keen interest in your dog from your avatar,it really is a beauitfull looking staffy its perfect

Could you if its no bother post up some pics of him,would love to see his whole body

Thank you, theres a few pics of kenny on the pic section

kenny d wrote:thanks dave, they've been ok since, kenny still warns her off, but hasnt reacted in the same way as last night. I proberly looked to much into it to. Im making an extra fuss of kenny, just in case, i also make sure me and ken get time alone too. I'll take some pics and another video. Thank you so much ))))

My OH was exactly the same and wouldn't let Tommy strut his stuff as he got older as poor Tilly was having a hard time , eventually persuaded her after chatting on here about it that it wasn't the right way to go and now things are working out fine. Tilly is mardy and has her place on Daddy's chair where she is safe , secure and happy , Tommy can do what he wants , she doesn't care . Outside , may the best man win     Works for me

   Thank you

I've never had two dogs together as I just know I couldn't cope - the mumsy in me would want to pick up tiny little Lilly and snuggle her all the time, and little puppies do need a lot of attention and loving. But Kenny, nose out of joint with a little interloper, needs just as much attention and loving at this time too, so you're tearing yourself in two.

I've only done it with children (3 years apart) but at least I could talk to and explain to my older child so that she understood, and that's not possible with dogs.

I know I'm not helping at all, but I do sympathise most sincerely.

Dave's been through it and got the T-shirt, you can't do better than to listen to him!

Hi Kelly,
We have Reggie 6 weeks now and the first 4 weeks especially had some fairly stressful moments exactly like the one you describe, Reggie kept trying to play with Rikki (my boxer, female), but he was being a typical boisterous puppy and I could see that Rikki on one hand wanted to play with him (she is a very boisterous player herself), but on the other hand found him really annoying and wanted him to go away. A game would start and for the first few weeks it was usually started by Reggie, but very quickly she would lose patience with him, as he would keep jumping up and grabbing her face, and she would give out to him by growling and pushing him away, just like Kenny was doing with Lilly. Reggie would heed her warning initially, but then come back at her a few seconds later, and she would do the same, if she had to tell him off more than a couple of times and he was still coming back to annoy her I would at that stage interrupt them. I didn't want her to have to escalate her responses, or start to feel stressed or unsafe, nor did I want him to get a fright or a bad experience from her. However the past 3 weeks have been brilliant, I started taking Reggie to work with me a couple of days, and Rikki started to greet Reggie really excitedly when we'd come home, she started to initiate play as much as he did (I cannot describe how happy I was when they had their first proper play out in the garden without me having to interrupt them) and he was playing much more appropriately and listening to her if she gave out to him. Taking them out walking together etc as I described in my other post definitely helped, as it gave them both space from each other if they needed it. Also the more fun stuff you do with both of them the more they will start to associate each other with good things.
I hope this has been some help and puts your mind at rest a bit , what you are experiencing is quite normal and I'm sure Kenny & Lily are going to be best pals

I've just seen pics of Lily, she is just gorgeous, love her markings, her and Kenny make a handsome pair!

I can only imagine how stressful this must be! Especially because Lilly is just a tiny baby and you don't want her to get hurt! I do think that you need to let them work it out instead of just removing Lilly. That way Lilly learns when Kenny has had enough! I understand this must be difficult and is easier said than done! I'm sure you are doing a great job..it is a big change and I know they will grow to be great friends once everyone settles in and adjusts to the new living arrangements! Stay positive and try not to be too hard on yourself!

Hi every1 and thank you, great advice here. Kenny and lilly are still getting along fine, she's still biting him, but im sure they'll work it out. My OH lets them get on with it (supervised) It's me, im a big baby, i just keep thinking he's going to rag her around. He's snarled and snapped at her a few times and that scared me. She still hasnt taken the hint, but im sure she will.
With other training, Lilly is coming on a dream. She now goes to the back door to be let in the garden for the toilet, she still has the odd little accident, but doing very well. Im counting down the days now so we can take them out for a little walk. I think this will them with the bonding. Kennys also booked in for the 9th july for neutering, so hopefully he'll calm a little (humping my cushions) lol. XX

Hi Kelly,
Great to hear things are going well Kenny's snapping and snarling, while it looks and sounds scary is his way of telling her off, rather than actually wanting to intentionally hurt her, and she will learn. Also, if you have friends with social, good tempered adult dogs, try and get her meeting these as well as soon as possible, experiences like that will all help her learn appropriate behaviour.

Glad to hear all going well. I think its right to let them get on with it supervised as you said. 

Morning every1, They both played well this morning. Kenny did something last night that he's never did before, He went up stairs and wee'd all over my bed!!! I think he's feeling insecure. I should of told him off, but didnt. It would of been pointless as i didnt see him do it, also, i wouldnt want to upset him anymore than he is. It may seem like im dragging it out, but im trying to give Kenny more space. I think its really important for him to feel secure and loved. So play sessions are back to basics at the moment. Or should i just carry on as normal? Sorry to be a pain, but just need to get this right. ))

Forgot to add, Kenny has on 2 occassions, run away from Lilly with his tail between his legs lol

I think with the jealousy issue make sure that every time Lilly is around it is a great time for Kenny. That he gets attention too and that he learns to associate her being around with good things happening to him, whatever it is that he really loves, make him associate it with her being there!

Hi every1, brilliant day 2today, played great, I supose there'll be good and bad as we go along x

I wish I could offer some useful advice Kelly but as I said, I've never had two dogs together, so I can't I'm afraid except to encourage you that it's still early days yet  

But weeing on the bed I have experienced (no, not me! Kuchar!)  It only happens sometimes and I'm pretty sure that it happened when he was upset about something.

Good to see your update! Very encouraging (((HUGS)))

kenny d wrote:Hi every1, brilliant day 2today, played great, I supose there'll be good and bad as we go along x

That's great news Kelly, I guess the more brill days, the more you relax, then the more brill days,     Lilly & ken.

Evening all, another good day, lilly is very Cheeky tho, I feed them separatly, molly was playing with lilly while I fed ken, she came running out straight to ken and started to eat his food. He was fab, just looked at her and carried on eating. I couldn't belive what I was watching, although I won't allow it to happen again. Sorry I can't add pics but I'm on her on my phone, laptop is playing up x

Aww thats good to hear,yeah its best they eat there own food for there ages but it nice to see that he would share his food with the pup,thats a very good sign imo

great stuff Kelly

Kenny is a hero - bless him. Sounds like things are coming together!