My Kami Girl

Hello Staffy Owners.

I am the proud owner of two Staffies. My baby girl though is my Kami (in pic). Kami is one and a half years old and the love in my life. She has also just made me the proud granny of 6 Staff pups. Only 7 days old. So there will be one new addition to my family.

Looking Forward to meeting new friends

Hi &

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Hi and welcome from us and Suki.

Hi and welcome to the forum from Rocky and me

Hi and welcome from me and the kids

Awww. Thanks

yvonne2003 wrote:Awww. Thanks

Sorry I've got to ask the question but how come she had a litter so young ??

hia from me and sasha

Hi and welcome from Kia and me

Hello and welcome from Tyson & me. Looking forward to getting to know you.

Hiya and welcome from me and Moo

Hello and welcome to the forum

Hi and welcome from me and Charlie.

Like Dave, I am curious to know how come she's already had puppies? At a year and a half old, she's still a pup herself.

shontelle wrote:Hi and welcome from me and Charlie.

Like Dave, I am curious to know how come she's already had puppies? At a year and a half old, she's still a pup herself.

Hi there. Thanks for the post.

In reply to the question. Kami showed no signs of being on heat ar the time. When I realised I split the two dogs but it was too late. I consulted advice as to the age and was told to abbort the puppies. Being anti abortion I decided to go through with the pregnancy. Kami is a big dog and I was sure with supervision and care she would be fine. I had also already assisted in the pregnancy and delivery of my other female staffs two litters.

Her pregnancy went well. I boosted her vitamins, increased her feeding and included milk into her diet. She carried full term and her delivery went exceptionally well. 6 perfect puppies.

My only problem that I am experiencing uis the puppies are very big and she can't produce enough milk. They are now a week yesterday and I have gotten puppy formula and teats from the vet and assisr with their feeding.

I don't regret one minute keeping the pups, but she will be steralized as I feel one litter is enough for her.

Regards

Yvonne.

Hey from me and Patch

welcome

dave g wrote:welcome

Thank You So Much

how could you not know she was in heat there some quite telling signs which im sure you must know with already having a b1tch .
this must have been her second season so naturaly you must have relised her next season was due.
and as for being anti abortion were talking about the health problems that could have happend with her being so young it like a ten year old girl being pregnant its just not right .
sorry to be coming across as harsh but sorry i find it a bit irisponsible that you let this happen .
oviously you see your self as a breeder as this is your third litter from your girls (so even more shocking you let this happen)

bigwazza wrote: how could you not know she was in heat there some quite telling signs which im sure you must know with already having a b1tch .
this must have been her second season so naturaly you must have relised her next season was due.
and as for being anti abortion were talking about the health problems that could have happend with her being so young it like a ten year old girl being pregnant its just not right .
sorry to be coming across as harsh but sorry i find it a bit irisponsible that you let this happen .
oviously you see your self as a breeder as this is your third litter from your girls (so even more shocking you let this happen)

Well let's start by saying I don't count the days between seasons. Secondly, we are all entitled to our opinions. And my opinion is that if you are any kind of friend and owner to your dog you will know whith what they can and can't cope with. Hence knowing my pet I knew she would cope. As for mental problems I. Was in constant contact with a friend who is the manager of the SPCA. Both mom and pups were under close monitor. Mom was put on special vitamins and a drops for the water. She carried her pups to full term and ALL six were born with two eyes, four paws, a tail, are able to suckle. At 7 days old their eyes are open and ears have developed. They have personalities of their own.

So please, do not judge unless you have been in the same position. Would you abort puppies you knew had a 99% chance of developing perfectly fine??? Yes I see myself as a breeder. Yes I have delivered pups, opened sacks, encouraged the mother to clean and chew off the cord. I have rubbed my dogs stomachs between contractions. Sat up till past 2 in the morning making sure all is ok. I do not regret my decision one bit and should you not like what I have to say feel free to stay off my profile.

steve76 wrote:Hello and welcome to the forum

Hi Steve

Thank You. I'd just like to say you have a STUNNING dog!!!!!!

yvonne2003 wrote:

bigwazza wrote: how could you not know she was in heat there some quite telling signs which im sure you must know with already having a b1tch .
this must have been her second season so naturaly you must have relised her next season was due.
and as for being anti abortion were talking about the health problems that could have happend with her being so young it like a ten year old girl being pregnant its just not right .
sorry to be coming across as harsh but sorry i find it a bit irisponsible that you let this happen .
oviously you see your self as a breeder as this is your third litter from your girls (so even more shocking you let this happen)

Well let's start by saying I don't count the days between seasons. Secondly, we are all entitled to our opinions. And my opinion is that if you are any kind of friend and owner to your dog you will know whith what they can and can't cope with. Hence knowing my pet I knew she would cope. As for mental problems I. Was in constant contact with a friend who is the manager of the SPCA. Both mom and pups were under close monitor. Mom was put on special vitamins and a drops for the water. She carried her pups to full term and ALL six were born with two eyes, four paws, a tail, are able to suckle. At 7 days old their eyes are open and ears have developed. They have personalities of their own.

So please, do not judge unless you have been in the same position. Would you abort puppies you knew had a 99% chance of developing perfectly fine??? Yes I see myself as a breeder. Yes I have delivered pups, opened sacks, encouraged the mother to clean and chew off the cord. I have rubbed my dogs stomachs between contractions. Sat up till past 2 in the morning making sure all is ok. I do not regret my decision one bit and should you not like what I have to say feel free to stay off my profile.

I'm sorry of it seems that some of us were coming across as harsh, but we all have the best interests of staffs at heart, and as we, and you as a breeder should know, 18 months old is far too young for pups. Bigwazza was just making the point that you as a breeder, and as the owner of girls before, should know that Kami was due her season. What's done is done, and thankfully, both Kami and the puppies are healthy and that's the main thing.

shontelle wrote:

yvonne2003 wrote:

bigwazza wrote: how could you not know she was in heat there some quite telling signs which im sure you must know with already having a b1tch .
this must have been her second season so naturaly you must have relised her next season was due.
and as for being anti abortion were talking about the health problems that could have happend with her being so young it like a ten year old girl being pregnant its just not right .
sorry to be coming across as harsh but sorry i find it a bit irisponsible that you let this happen .
oviously you see your self as a breeder as this is your third litter from your girls (so even more shocking you let this happen)

Well let's start by saying I don't count the days between seasons. Secondly, we are all entitled to our opinions. And my opinion is that if you are any kind of friend and owner to your dog you will know whith what they can and can't cope with. Hence knowing my pet I knew she would cope. As for mental problems I. Was in constant contact with a friend who is the manager of the SPCA. Both mom and pups were under close monitor. Mom was put on special vitamins and a drops for the water. She carried her pups to full term and ALL six were born with two eyes, four paws, a tail, are able to suckle. At 7 days old their eyes are open and ears have developed. They have personalities of their own.

So please, do not judge unless you have been in the same position. Would you abort puppies you knew had a 99% chance of developing perfectly fine??? Yes I see myself as a breeder. Yes I have delivered pups, opened sacks, encouraged the mother to clean and chew off the cord. I have rubbed my dogs stomachs between contractions. Sat up till past 2 in the morning making sure all is ok. I do not regret my decision one bit and should you not like what I have to say feel free to stay off my profile.

I'm sorry of it seems that some of us were coming across as harsh, but we all have the best interests of staffs at heart, and as we, and you as a breeder should know, 18 months old is far too young for pups. Bigwazza was just making the point that you as a breeder, and as the owner of girls before, should know that Kami was due her season. What's done is done, and thankfully, both Kami and the puppies are healthy and that's the main thing.

Yes, I understand what you saying. My first female did not come into season so early. And she had two litters. So I basically worked according to Skyla. But so you learn that dogs as humans obviously don't all develope the same.

I love all my Staffs, but Kami and I have been through a lot together. I will give my life for that girl. She sits in my lap. And at her age still sleeps on my lap. I would never do anything to endanger her life. And had the pregnancy gone bad at any stage I would not have hesitated to take her to my vet and had I have to chose I would have terminated the pregnancy if her life was endangered.

But thank you for your comments. Had Bigwazza chosen his wording a bit better I would not have retaliated so badly.

Welcome too the site from myself and the gang.

I do agree she was far too young too have a litter but i understand why you kept the pups, im not one for abortion either, i just hope you get her done too avoid this happening in future.

Imo a breeder is someone who breeds too better the breed not someone who allows there dog too get pregnant by accident.

xXxshelly_stanliexXx wrote:Welcome too the site from myself and the gang.

I do agree she was far too young too have a litter but i understand why you kept the pups, im not one for abortion either, i just hope you get her done too avoid this happening in future.

Imo a breeder is someone who breeds too better the breed not someone who allows there dog too get pregnant by accident.

Hi there.

Yes she was too young. And yes, for sure you breed to better the breed. Kami was my first born from my first litter. She was pick of the litter. She out looked her parents and the rest of the litter. It was decided by myself that I wanted to find a male for her with the same Jock look. I still need to post picks of her litter but they are by far my best. They are 7 days old but are the size of a two week pup. And strong. I will be keeping one. Whether or not I will continue breeding I don't know. But I do know that I will not be having another litter with my Kami.

And also, I do not sell my puppies, I work hand in hand with the SPCA. If somebody wants a pup they need to go through the necessary checks and the SPCA puts a chip in the neck and gives them the necessary injections. They do charge the person a set fee but I'd feel much happier knowing my pups went to good homes where follow up checks are done.

I think what you maybe need to understand Yvonne is 1) Its quite a scarey thought for a puppy to be having puppies - which I can see you do, but the other one for us in the UK as well is that 2) we have a massive problem with Staffies in that the rescues are absolutely bursting at the seems with them so people can get very sensitive about issues. I believe I am correct in saying you don't face the same problems in SA , according to one of our other members Lynne.
So what exactly is the SPCA, I was thinking along the lines of the RSPCA in the UK which is for the well being of animals and ultimately a rescue organisation , so from my understanding for us naive people in the UK it reads like you have a litter and then hand them over to a rescue , so this is where the confusion may be , sorry for all the questions

Your dog problem must be extremely different to ours.

Is the SPCA a charity? Sorry to sound dumb but that sounds like a shelter that you give the pups too, please correct me

Im a tad bit confussed, not that it takes much.

I thought this was an accidental litter, yet correct me if im wrong but you say you wanted too find a male with the "jock look" or have i read that wrong. !!!

Agree with what daves said above. Michelle

xXxshelly_stanliexXx wrote:Im a tad bit confussed, not that it takes much.

I thought this was an accidental litter, yet correct me if im wrong but you say you wanted too find a male with the "jock look" or have i read that wrong. !!!

Agree with what daves said above. Michelle

Gosh. This whole thing is going round in circles.

I planned on breeding with Kami. But only later. I wanted her to bread with a male her colour because of her jock look. The two grew up together. Kami was suppose to go into season. Rest. Then with the second season I would have mated the two. Unfortunately because Kamis mom Skyla who had my first litter came into season later I was expecting the same of Kami. Had I known she was already in season I would have put my male seperate to her. But things did not go that way.

So basically to sum up. Yes Kami was going to be bred with. No not at such a young age. That was accidental. I also just want to clarify to everybody that I do not believe in breeding puppies with puppies. Neither do I practice such stuff. HOWEVER, Kami's pregnancy was not planned and she got pregnant. Because Kami was so young I too had to give her my constant attention. Monitoring her. Taking her for checkups. Extra vitamins. Making sure she got enough milk daily. But it happened and she fell pregnant so I had no choice but to do my part and make sure she was healthy aat all times.

janey wrote:Your dog problem must be extremely different to ours.

Is the SPCA a charity? Sorry to sound dumb but that sounds like a shelter that you give the pups too, please correct me

Hi Janey.

The SPCA is the same as RSPCA. They rescue abandoned animals. Abused animals. From cats to Dogs to Horses.

Now I volunteer at my local RSPCA and am good friends with the manager. I don't "give" my puppies to the RSPCA. I merely request their assistance in making sure my puppy is going to a good home, will be chipped with all their owners contact details in case they get out and they make sure injections are up to date.

Here people have pets for the sake of security. The more vicious the better. Very very few people are looking for a pet. A friend and companion.

These animals are a stunning breed but if in the wrong hands they can be trained to fight. So if you want a puppy of mine, make sure you are willing that the living conditions will be inspected. If you are a genuine pet person there will be no problems.

Yvonne, if you are breeding the pups then surely its up to you to find homes first to make sure they have there vacs and that homes are eligible.

Again, maybe things are different here but having a rescue and seeing how many are pts breaks my heart.

Is it not aiding a problem? Xx

janey wrote:


Yvonne, if you are breeding the pups then surely its up to you to find homes first to make sure they have there vacs and that homes are eligible.

Again, maybe things are different here but having a rescue and seeing how many are pts breaks my heart.

Is it not aiding a problem? Xx

Hey. Things seem to be very different here. I can find a suitable person and they can give me their word they will take them for their injections. All hunky dory. But as soon as that pup is handed over you no longer have a say. So they could have "bullshitted" you abt living arrangements, and they could say they have no money for injections. You are stuck.

That is why I have no problem finding a home but prefer a higher authority to do inspections and injections before the puppy is handed over.

Here as a registered breeder the pups will have homes before the litter is available, deposits are taken, first jabs etc should be done and soon (I hope) pups will be chipped b4 they go to there homes.

I think the staff problem is so huge here and flipant (sp) attitude towards breeding can grate. It does on me, but what is done now is done.

If you choose to breed in the future think about the wider picture Xx

so you go to the expense of breeding puppies (which over here isn't cheap) for no personal gain , to give the puppies away to people that are checked out by the SPCA for a small fee to them to make sure they are chipped and vaccinated etc. And you own a male around same age as Kami that you planned to breed with but will not breed with any more as Kami has expired her time as a Dam due to an accidental litter , sounds quite complicated for us english people thats why we are so confused , sorry
Your profile only lists Kami , no other dogs so mybe we have been confused as you didn't introduce yourself with your mail as well and we can onluy guess by the details in front of us, again sorry for all the questions

yvonne2003 wrote:

bigwazza wrote: how could you not know she was in heat there some quite telling signs which im sure you must know with already having a b1tch .
this must have been her second season so naturaly you must have relised her next season was due.
and as for being anti abortion were talking about the health problems that could have happend with her being so young it like a ten year old girl being pregnant its just not right .
sorry to be coming across as harsh but sorry i find it a bit irisponsible that you let this happen .
oviously you see your self as a breeder as this is your third litter from your girls (so even more shocking you let this happen)

Well let's start by saying I don't count the days between seasons. Secondly, we are all entitled to our opinions. And my opinion is that if you are any kind of friend and owner to your dog you will know whith what they can and can't cope with. Hence knowing my pet I knew she would cope. As for mental problems I. Was in constant contact with a friend who is the manager of the SPCA. Both mom and pups were under close monitor. Mom was put on special vitamins and a drops for the water. She carried her pups to full term and ALL six were born with two eyes, four paws, a tail, are able to suckle. At 7 days old their eyes are open and ears have developed. They have personalities of their own.

So please, do not judge unless you have been in the same position. Would you abort puppies you knew had a 99% chance of developing perfectly fine??? Yes I see myself as a breeder. Yes I have delivered pups, opened sacks, encouraged the mother to clean and chew off the cord. I have rubbed my dogs stomachs between contractions. Sat up till past 2 in the morning making sure all is ok. I do not regret my decision one bit and should you not like what I have to say feel free to stay off my profile.

Hi but sorry your really not making this easy for me lol
you have stated yes you would class your self as a breeder but sorry a breeder would know within a week or so when there girl was going to be in season so this accident would not have happened.
and sorry there was no way you can say if i knew there was a 99%chance of every thing being ok with the pregnancy you could never be that sure.
and as for staying off your profile that is the role of the moderating team so again no i wont be stop reading your posts

Hi and welcome. Glad everything turned out OK with Kami and her pups.

Gosh no. This has all just given me one heck of a headache.

Perhaps it a culture difference I don't know. But what I do know is I would NEVER intentionally endander the lives of any of my Staffs.

And no Kami's time time has not expired I'm just worried about her carrying a second litter.

Finally I have read all commenrs thank you but honestly I joined this forum to make new friends and gain advice on topics. Not debate over the pregnancy of my Saff.

Dave wrote:I think what you maybe need to understand Yvonne is 1) Its quite a scarey thought for a puppy to be having puppies - which I can see you do, but the other one for us in the UK as well is that 2) we have a massive problem with Staffies in that the rescues are absolutely bursting at the seems with them so people can get very sensitive about issues. I believe I am correct in saying you don't face the same problems in SA , according to one of our other members Lynne.
So what exactly is the SPCA, I was thinking along the lines of the RSPCA in the UK which is for the well being of animals and ultimately a rescue organisation , so from my understanding for us naive people in the UK it reads like you have a litter and then hand them over to a rescue , so this is where the confusion may be , sorry for all the questions

Ok. This is all just getting to be a bit much much. I joined this forum to meet new friends, share stories and gain knowledge. But all that I have been doing is try and justify myself as too Kamis pregnancy. At the end of the day it happened, she fell pregnant and now there is a additional 6 staffie pups to the Staffie community. Never would I intentially put the life of any of my Staffs in danger. I'm sorry if other contries have problems with Staffies, but here in SA staffies are generally not abandoned. As a volunteer at RSPCA I should know as I care for all the abandoned and and abused dogs. Not once have I seen a Staffie.

So thank you all for the comments but I would like to end this topic now and rather spend my time exploring the forum.

I joined this forum to meet new friends and.

well you certainly raised a discussion

Hope you find what you need on here and stick around

Hi and welcome.

Firstly whats done is done the pups are here so theres no point crying over split milk so to speak.

One thing i am amazed at and maybe our UK born stafford pups are backwards in development and that is your pups eyes were open at 7 days old, our UK slow buggers open theirs at 10 days

Accidents do happen, and they have happened to the best breeders going but if the females too young their given the miss mate jab that is no way to be confused with having an abortion, its more like the morning after pill it just gives a rush of hormones that stops a mating turning to a pregnancy.
The jab can be given upto 45 days after a mating has been seen, but the later its done the more likely hood of it not working, or only aborting half a litter and maybe the birth of deformed pups resulting due to a later jab .... its classed say as an abortion now as the pregnancy was allowed to develop.

Denise wrote:Hi and welcome.

Firstly whats done is done the pups are here so theres no point crying over split milk so to speak.

One thing i am amazed at and maybe our UK born stafford pups are backwards in development and that is your pups eyes were open at 7 days old, our UK slow buggers open theirs at 10 days

Accidents do happen, and they have happened to the best breeders going but if the females too young their given the miss mate jab that is no way to be confused with having an abortion, its more like the morning after pill it just gives a rush of hormones that stops a mating turning to a pregnancy.
The jab can be given upto 45 days after a mating has been seen, but the later its done the more likely hood of it not working, or only aborting half a litter and maybe the birth of deformed pups resulting due to a later jab .... its classed say as an abortion now as the pregnancy was allowed to develop.

Hi Denise.

Thank you for that ino. You see here in SA I'm not even sure how qualified some of the vets are. They never mentioned a jab.

You know my first two litters were much smaller than this lot and took between 10 and 12 days to open their eyes. . These guys are massive. Perhaps that's why their eyes opened sooner. Even their little ears have flapped down. Its soo cute!!!!!!!

It could well be the vets in SA are naff and are not up to speed with new medication etc i cant say as i have no knowledge or experience of your vets.
But puppy size does not determine development rate, at 7 days you may start to see the slit of the eye opening but you cant say eye is open till they are fully.
Ear flaps maybe down, but have you checked to see if the opening to the ear has opened.

Will these pups be homed from your house with the rescue just checking new homes out for you.
We do do things over here differently, and most would and are seeing it as passing the buck ( getting rescue to sort your homing problem)
Our rescues over here have a hard enough time trying to find homes for the dogs in their care with out the added burden of helping out a breeder home all their pups. So ppl on here who have commented have this in mind so i hope you can understand where their coming from.

Denise wrote:It could well be the vets in SA are naff and are not up to speed with new medication etc i cant say as i have no knowledge or experience of your vets.
But puppy size does not determine development rate, at 7 days you may start to see the slit of the eye opening but you cant say eye is open till they are fully.
Ear flaps maybe down, but have you checked to see if the opening to the ear has opened.

Will these pups be homed from your house with the rescue just checking new homes out for you.
We do do things over here differently, and most would and are seeing it as passing the buck ( getting rescue to sort your homing problem)
Our rescues over here have a hard enough time trying to find homes for the dogs in their care with out the added burden of helping out a breeder home all their pups. So ppl on here who have commented have this in mind so i hope you can understand where their coming from.

Hey Denise

You are right. Their eyes are open but not 100%. They still muffle along. Lol. The first thing I checked when their ears started their flaps was to see if the ear was developing inside. And thankfully the are all developing.

As for our vets. Well. Ja. No comment. And some have no heart. I took my dog to emergencies once in the evening. She was vommiting. I had to pay upfront before they would even look at her. It was a bad time of the month. I guaranteed I would pay them in the week. They turned me away. That's how sick it is here. Its all about the money. Thank goodness the RSPCA was able to help me.

You see I am friends with the top manager who runs our local RSPCA. I didn't want them to home them. I just wanted them to assist in the home inspection. And to make sure the new owners know to take their new puppy for its follow up visits. The puppies would be here with me until a home was found. My friend was here a few minutes ago. I spoke to him and said I will find homes for the pups. He said he would guide me through the home visits process. So I will be handling the pups now myself, but with his guidance when needed.

A belated welcome from me and our mutts here in Port Elizabeth

Chantel wrote:A belated welcome from me and our mutts here in Port Elizabeth

Thanks. And STUNNING "muts". Really nice!!

Hi & welcome to the forum ><

Hello and welcome aboard