blue staffys

by **i love leah and lois** Wed Nov 09 2011, 13:40

First topic message reminder :

Just a question how much would i have to pay for a blue staffy without the papers,I know if they have the papers.Then they can cost a lot more.What would be a reasonable price to pay for one without papers.

by **gem** Thu Nov 10 2011, 23:41

Jackieb wrote:We paid £750 for my beautiful KC Reg Blue staffy. Good pedigree with champs in it.

She came from blue/white Sire and Blue/White Dam. Grandparents also blue/white Great Grandparents: black/brindle

My diesel has black nose/nails/dark eyes/ eye rims.... all as per breed standard...lot of unregistered blue are more grey in color with blue eyes.

I always wanted a staffy - wasnt fussed on the color - but saw Diesel and fell in love, We bought from a good breeder and she has good lines..but that hasnt stopped her having skin issues. [wouldnt change her for the world tho]

I know a lot of ppl say blue is a dilute black [yes] more issues etc but I know a lot of 'other color staffs that have a whole load of issues. I think there is a lot of general negativity assiciated with Blues tbh

All I can say is - do your research - for any color staffy. Always be KC Registered... and ALWAYS insure them !

Its genetically impossible for a blue to have black in it the whole dog is diluted not just some of it . I dont think that people are negative your dog is beautiful its just the muppet breeders who are pushing them of as rare, special, pure, exploiting the colour I hate that Smile

by ***Karen*** Fri Nov 11 2011, 07:15

Gem don't be making assumptions the breeder in Question is actually a friend of a friend (not that I'm best buddies with her) but her girls have litters every other year and are well looked after and she does breed within the kc regulations ie not after girls are 5 1/2 years etc
She's also extremely proud of their bloodlines and even questioned us to make Sure the pup was going to a loving home
I know situations do exist as u described but don't be so quick to judge everybody

by Guest Fri Nov 11 2011, 08:17

awww karen please dont think anyone is purposley trying to slate the breeder its just based on the info we have been given ie breeding long lines of blues together she doesnt seem like she has the best interests of the breed at heart as any ethical breeder wouldnt dream of mating to blues let along a long line of them. I personally think blue staffs are lovely, not a colour i would choose but then again i strongly support rescuing (im a dog walker for a rescue) so colour doesnt really come into it when so many thousands and thousands of staffs are looking for homes.

by **gem** Fri Nov 11 2011, 08:31

*Karen* wrote:Gem don't be making assumptions the breeder in Question is actually a friend of a friend (not that I'm best buddies with her) but her girls have litters every other year and are well looked after and she does breed within the kc regulations ie not after girls are 5 1/2 years etc
She's also extremely proud of their bloodlines and even questioned us to make Sure the pup was going to a loving home
I know situations do exist as u described but don't be so quick to judge everybody

I apologise I really should think before I type I didnt want to offend you I do unfortunatly jump to conclusions because its happening all over it upsets me I want to see breeding done to better the breed and not just for financial gains and im glad for her dogs they have the life you say, > Big Grin

<

by ***Karen*** Fri Nov 11 2011, 09:17

Sorry it might have been a harsh comeback just one of those mornings!
I do agree though that I hate the thought of girls just being pupped non stop and there's enuf dogs in rescue without adding more!
Blues are obviously a bit controversial and to be honest my little girls eyes are a bit green (light) but in all other ways I think she's a good example of the breed but then I'm her mummy so of course i'm biased!!!

by **Nosipho** Fri Nov 11 2011, 11:13

I saw some pups sired by Ch. Valglo jeff's choice for sale in my local paper, they wanted £600 for the blacks and £1200 for the blues! Ridiculous!

by Guest Fri Nov 11 2011, 11:30

*Karen* wrote:Sorry it might have been a harsh comeback just one of those mornings!
I do agree though that I hate the thought of girls just being pupped non stop and there's enuf dogs in rescue without adding more!
Blues are obviously a bit controversial and to be honest my little girls eyes are a bit green (light) but in all other ways I think she's a good example of the breed but then I'm her mummy so of course i'm biased!!!

Well one thing that cant be argued is gorgeous lol!!

by **Nosipho** Fri Nov 11 2011, 11:39

The health issues in Blue is all down to genetics. As there were so few blues that occured naturally people started breeding for colour only, that meant to get more blues they crossed the few blues that they had. This means the resulting pups are likely to be more inbred as they come from similar lines, thus increasing the risk or genetic issues. Also as we know blue is a dilute of black, animals/humans which have a dilute gene (albinos, 'blue' etc) have less protection against the elements and their skin is usually more sensitive. Breeding two dogs which are closely related will bring this issues out even moreso, no evidence needed just common sense. People please correct me if I'm wrong I'm still learning!!!

I know what I mean but genetics are hard to explain. See the links below:

* http://www.vetgen.com/canine-coat-color.html
* http://www.dreamybluestaffords.com/apps/blog/

by billy and kya Fri Nov 11 2011, 15:37

very good lc thumbs up

by **Andy** Fri Nov 11 2011, 15:49

Nosipho wrote:The health issues in Blue is all down to genetics. As there were so few blues that occured naturally people started breeding for colour only, that meant to get more blues they crossed the few blues that they had. This means the resulting pups are likely to be more inbred as they come from similar lines, thus increasing the risk or genetic issues. Also as we know blue is a dilute of black, animals/humans which have a dilute gene (albinos, 'blue' etc) have less protection against the elements and their skin is usually more sensitive. Breeding two dogs which are closely related will bring this issues out even moreso, no evidence needed just common sense. People please correct me if I'm wrong I'm still learning!!!

I know what I mean but genetics are hard to explain. See the links below:

* http://www.vetgen.com/canine-coat-color.html
* http://www.dreamybluestaffords.com/apps/blog/

Your second link explain's what I've been saying in this thread! ... and that is basically that tho the blues are critisised for show conformiity, it's still a colour thing !!! .. I've seen nothing to say say blues have, or are prone to anymore "HEALTH" issue's because of thier "colour alone" anymore than any other colour, apart from what has been said in this thread! I understand about keeping the line strong by introducing black, but again, this is to stop the blue colour from washing out, not to counter these "supposed" health issues ... ANY colour example will suffer if inbred, or the quality isnt sort after when breeding and money is the goal, but a good blue to a good blue, is surely no differant to a good black to a good black !!!

by Guest Fri Nov 11 2011, 16:13

??? Yes it is different......why would you breed a blue bitch which does not conform to the stafford standard with a blue dog which also doesnt conform to the stafford standard? You would get pups which also do not conform. Breed a blue with a black and u may or may not get blue pups but if u did its pigmantation would be better. But to me the main point here is breeders should be breeding to the standard and the standard alone, colour is a secondary consideration. A dog and a bitch should be found who fit the standard and who complement eachother near to perfectly......to hell with the clour of them and the colours they produce. With the amount of staffords out there i see no reason why a "ethical" breeder would feel the need to put two blues together when there is so much other choice other than the fact they wont 2 be sure of blue pups which equalls money.

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 16:20

this website status an differnet opinion

http://www.riospitbull.com/blue_pitbulls.htm

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 16:27

http://www.ehow.com/about_6117218_blue-coat-dog-health-problems.html

another one for you it's just common sense really if you have a dog with a weaker genes or not normal colour you dont breed it same type of dog or you going to make the weak gene weaker and health problem will pop in some form or another.

by **Nosipho** Fri Nov 11 2011, 16:33

Steve wrote:http://www.ehow.com/about_6117218_blue-coat-dog-health-problems.html

another one for you it's just common sense really if you have a dog with a weaker genes or not normal colour you dont breed it same type of dog or you going to make the weak gene weaker and health problem will pop in some form or another.

Lol, thats what I was trying to sya in a roundabout way!!! and yes the second link does support your thinking Andy thats why I posted it, but it has no scientific thinking behind it it's just the thoughts of one breeder Smile

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 16:47

if you go onto working dog website they wont even talk about blues, some working dog breeders will even put blue pup down.

by Guest Fri Nov 11 2011, 17:36

Andy wrote:a good blue to a good blue, is surely no differant to a good black to a good black !!!

No, I'm sorry, breeding a dilute to a dilute will produce inferior colour. Maybe not in all the pups, but in quite a few of them. You will get blue or brown noses, light eyes & sensitive skin. By breeding a blue back to a non blue brindle or a black you will keep pigment strong & maybe still get some blue pups.

Any breeder who mates blue to blue is doing it purely for money, not for the betterment of the breed. If it was for the betterment of the breed colour wouldn't come into it!

by **Andy** Fri Nov 11 2011, 18:35

.. guys .. we keep movin away from my argument !! which is PROOF or a SCIENTIFICALLY based explanation of what HEALTH issues effect BLUE'S JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE BLUE !!

Senseitive skin is not just a blue thing!! I know of lots of Staffy's that have had skin problems .. and none were blue!! they can all get skin issue's ..

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 18:41

Andy wrote:Senseitive skin is not just a blue thing!!

i'm going to do a page about it give me chance.

blue is like albino we all know they have skin problems, eye problems and hearing problems & you keep breeding blue with blues the problem it will get worse not better.

by **Jackieb** Fri Nov 11 2011, 18:57

breeding whites with whites is ok tho ?

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 19:01

no that can also make health issues

by **Andy** Fri Nov 11 2011, 19:05

Steve wrote:
Andy wrote:Senseitive skin is not just a blue thing!!

i'm going to do a page about it give me chance.

blue is like albino we all know they have skin problems, eye problems and hearing problems & you keep breeding blue with blues the problem it will get worse not better.

Steve sorry I disagree! ... how can you say blue is like albino !!! doh

... albino effects lots of differant species including humans! and is no doubt very well documented.

are you saying blue staffy's are prone to blindness & deffness ? ... I've never heard of a case !!

by billy and kya Fri Nov 11 2011, 19:08

i asked my vet why my last staff had skin problems and she said because he is a staff and they are a law to there own Big Grin

by **Steve** Fri Nov 11 2011, 19:14

This is just going around and around, just do your own research about blue dog not just staffy. You will find out there are alot more health issue with blue and also white then the rest of the colours.

No responsible breeder will breed 2 blues together....

by Guest Sat Nov 12 2011, 09:28

Andy wrote:
Steve wrote:
Andy wrote:Senseitive skin is not just a blue thing!!

i'm going to do a page about it give me chance.

blue is like albino we all know they have skin problems, eye problems and hearing problems & you keep breeding blue with blues the problem it will get worse not better.

Steve sorry I disagree! ... how can you say blue is like albino !!! ... albino effects lots of differant species including humans! and is no doubt very well documented.

are you saying blue staffy's are prone to blindness & deffness ? ... I've never heard of a case !!

No i dont "think" blues are prone to blindness or deafness....?? Whites certainally are though! All i can say is personally (and through experience from working in rescue and dealing with vets etc) i believe blues and whites are more prone to skin complaints than other colours. I get what your saying that you want proof of health related issues from blues but im just saying for me its the fact 99% of blues dont meet the stafford standard 1. because their dilute gene will never allow them to and 2. most are bred for colour alone and conformation doesnt come into it.

by **Steve** Sat Nov 12 2011, 09:56

ok this topic is at its end

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