Picture of Harlem!!!

Finally i got around to posting pictures of Harlem. Could anyone tell me when his head is going to split? Hes only 10 months old.

The 1st pic belong is of his parents. His mother on the left and dad on the left. that's harlem on the bottom row.

Nice looking boy, but I'm assuming he isn't KC registered? If that's the case, it's difficult to know exactly when he'll fill out, because you don't know what's in his background.

As to his head splitting - it doesn't! The muscles will grow & strengthen & they will amke that furrow on top of his head appear. But he's still very young, he'll probably stop growing upwards very soon & will then start to fill out.

He is KC registered. and yes thank you.

I'm sorry, but if you're in the UK he cannot be registered, as he's a merle. The KC no longer register merle staffords.

If the breeder told you he's registered then he's either falsified the registration colour or he's lied to you. Either way, the registration isn't valid.

I beg your pardon, the ban on merles came into effect at the start of this year, so his registration may be valid.

However, in order to get merle there will have been a cross somewhere in his background, so it's still difficult to say exactly how he'll turn out.

Yes, none of parents are merle. His mother does carry the gene. Hes was born 2012 last year. I have paper with me now and his 5 generations KC paper work is on its way to me and should arrive any day now.

Oh my god, his colour is amazing he's stunning. It looks like the shape of his head is already starting to change, so probably won't be long. Loki's looked absolutely flat for a while, like Harlem's does a bit, before it started changing again, so should probably be soon.

Please post more pics more often, he's beautiful

Plus im pretty sure KC only banned Merle to Merle. "The Kennel Club has announced today that 2012 will be the last year the club will register the offspring from two merle parents." - KC

I personally don't like to see merles in staffords. Don't get me wrong, your dog's gorgeous, but the merle pattern brings so many terrible health problems, and it doesn't occur naturally in staffords. It was introduced by cross breeding a few generations ago by unscrupulous people who thought it might look nice.

I personally don't like to see merles in staffords. Don't get me wrong, your dog's gorgeous, but the merle pattern brings so many terrible health problems, and it doesn't occur naturally in staffords. It was introduced by cross breeding a few generations ago by unscrupulous people who thought it might look nice.

KingKane wrote:Plus im pretty sure KC only banned Merle to Merle. "The Kennel Club has announced today that 2012 will be the last year the club will register the offspring from two merle parents." - KC

Not true, I'm afraid..........

"Merle to merle mating in dogs21-May-12

Following a recommendation from the Dog Health Group, the General Committee has agreed that, with effect from 1st January 2013, the Kennel Club will no longer accept the registration of any puppies for any breed that are produced as a result of mating two merle (dapple) coloured parents together.

The merle mutation is a dominant mutation that causes the characteristic merle or dapple colour pattern in a number of breeds. It is also known that there can be associated health risks in those dogs that have the merle mutation.

Many breeds have lived with the merle gene in their population and have avoided merle to merle matings for many years. Some breeds have successfully requested formal banning of such matings and the Kennel Club will not now accept any litter for registration where both parents are merle for Shetland Sheepdogs, Dachshunds (all varieties) and Beaucerons (although these are called tricolour).

In the breeds where merle is proven to not occur naturally, the Kennel Club will not register any dogs that are merle coloured – these include Chihuahuas (Long and Smooth), Staffordshire Bull Terriers, Bull Terriers and Bull Terriers (Miniature). In addition, the Kennel Club will not register litters from Chihuahuas where one parent is merle coloured.

Merle patterning, patches of lighter colour appearing in the coat, is the result of the M gene in the dog. There are two alleles of this gene: MM (merle) and M+ (non-merle), with merle (MM) being dominant to non-merle (M+). In some breeds, the effect of the merle allele (MM) is termed ‘dapple’.

Unfortunately, the effects of the merle allele (MM) are not confined to coat patterning and we know that there can be an increased risk of impaired hearing and sight associated with it, particularly in dogs that are homozygous for MM (dogs that carry two copies of the MM allele).

Due to the associated health concerns, it is not believed that serious breeders would intentionally mate a merle to merle but the commencement of this restriction in January 2013 allows breeders time to readjust any planned breeding programmes."

Hmmm, I understand why you don't but i think its gorgeous color at least him and his litter. No health problems because of his grandmother being merle. Harlem's mother was blue and his dad was tiger. So as far as im concerned as my vets hes health.

When i breed him it wont be MERLE to MERLE. I will bred him with my sister blue staff when i move back to America. Who knows i might not even. hes still the sexiest staff in Suffolk.

Maybe, maybe not. Health problems often don't show until later in life - hopefully he'll be ok.

However, I'm glad that no more merle stafford pups will be registered. It just isn't worth the risk of the health problems that can occur....

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t20226-merle-colour-patterning-in-the-staffordshire-bull-terrier

Please don't breed him - the merle pattern is foreign to the stafford & simply shouldn't be there. There are too many really bad health problems with it.

If you breed from him in this country and any of the puppies are merle they cannot be registered with the KC.

Ive read that before, that's what brought me to the forum in the 1st place. Yea hell be good. I like different so hes different. I completely understand your reason though because I can see people getting careless with merle on merle. I do have a question How will the KC know if his kids have merle or not in them?

I problem wont. More than likely.

KingKane wrote:Ive read that before, that's what brought me to the forum in the 1st place. Yea hell be good. I like different so hes different. I completely understand your reason though because I can see people getting careless with merle on merle. I do have a question How will the KC know if his kids have merle or not in them?

If the breeder tries to register them honestly then the registration will be rejected. If the breeder (you in this case) registers them dishonestly then the registration is invalid, and you would be guilty of a criminal offence - ie deception - when you sell the pups as registered.

Obviously if any of the pups were to be entered into a show they would be asked to leave the ring.

None of my dogs are show dogs. You must have a deep hatred for merle staffies. I cant help he was born this way. I still love him anyways. I'm just a other staffie owner, hes still gorgeous to me.

Caryll wrote:I personally don't like to see merles in staffords. Don't get me wrong, your dog's gorgeous, but the merle pattern brings so many terrible health problems, and it doesn't occur naturally in staffords. It was introduced by cross breeding a few generations ago by unscrupulous people who thought it might look nice.

It's a shame it brings so many health problems and for that reason I wouldn't actively support it, but dogs that already exist, there's no denying it's an absolutely amazing colour, for sure

Harlem is a real cutey It is obvious that you love him and with those big puppy dog eyes how could you not!

While I am not willing to join the discussion regarding the merle as I feel Caryll has provided all the valid information and advice required, I will say that NOBODY here (including Caryll) has a hatred for any dog.

We DO however hate to see unwell dogs of any kind, and it would be irresponsible of us to not provide information and advice in relation to probable health issues with colour and/or breeding where we are able to do this

Yea they do and hes no different, Tara. yes and i am glad she did, because i am also a dog handler with the air force and i have 4 german shep, i work with day in and day out. Last thing I would want to see is ANY dog or offspring be unhealthy or have health issues. Glad she told i wont breed him.

Its nothing to do with your dog not being gorgeous! I think is color is awesome and he is a beautiful looking dog. Its the health risks that come along with the merle color that is the problem. No one is denying that your dog is still gorgeous. The merle color for the breed is not a good thing because its unnatural to SBTs and has been bred into them simply for aesthetics which, in turn, causes impaired hearing and vision. Maybe this doesn't happen in ALL merle dogs but it is much more likely to happen.

"heterozygous merle & they are the result of a merle bred to a non-merle. Heterozygous merles are also called normal merles or clean merles & are just as healthy as almost any other color. " i thought non-merle and merle we fine?

KingKane wrote:None of my dogs are show dogs. You must have a deep hatred for merle staffies. I cant help he was born this way. I still love him anyways. I'm just a other staffie owner, hes still gorgeous to me.

I most certainly don't hate merles, it's the unscrupulous breeders who have introduced merles into the breed that I hate! And please don't think I have anything against your dog or his siblings - I don't, he's a beauty.

KingKane wrote:"heterozygous merle & they are the result of a merle bred to a non-merle. Heterozygous merles are also called normal merles or clean merles & are just as healthy as almost any other color. " i thought non-merle and merle we fine?

Whether or not a merle is from two merles, one merle, or has a merle somewhere in the background isn't the issue here. It is a colour pattern that is totally foreign to the stafford & has been brought about by deceiptful cross breeding somewhere in the past (I'm not aiming that at your pup's breeders, by the way - it was way bfeore their time!). Whether or not there are health problems in individual dogs, merle can bring health problems with it, even in pups born to merle x standard. Also, if you were to breed your dog the chances are he would produce merle pups & those pups could not be registered.

But why perpetuate a colour pattern that is not only alien to the breed, but injurious to their health?

I think you need to check your dog's KC registration, what colour is on his certificate?....

http://www.ourdogs.co.uk/News/2010/Jan2010/News290110/merle.htm

Merle stafford pups have not been registered with the KC since 2010. Your breeder must have registered your pup with the wrong colour.

I completely understand what your saying. No worries here! I love my little boy to death. I can say Thank you for the information. ;D

hes registered under fawn and white which is colors.

KingKane wrote:hes registered under fawn and white which is colors.

I'm really, really sorry, but your dog's kc registration is invalid. Your breeders have lied in order to register him and he is, basically, non registered.

He's a red merle, and as such cannot be registered with the UK kennel club.

It is a shame that the breeders lied about his color in order to register him with the KC! He is definitely a merle and not a fawn and white. This is very unfortunate! However it doesn't change the fact that Harlem is a beautiful dog and that you obviously love him very much! Im sure it will not bother you that he is not KC registered and that you will love him just as much regardless! You are not a fault for your breeder being irresponsible and deceitful! However you were talking about breeding Harlem in earlier posts and I hope now that you have been well informed you will change your mind and absolutely under no circumstances breed him! This would be totally 100% careless! Im sure you love staffords just as much as everyone else here and do not want to take part in irresponsible breeding!!

Harlems Dad looks gorgeous dosent he. Harlems mum is a very dilute blue IMO. (Light eyes, nails, nose)
Harlem looks a cheeky lil chap ! I hope u enjoy him, u obviously care an awful lot for him - a basic which every Staffy deserves !

As Caryll said breeding is far from ideal, enjoy him as part of the family x

I love him very much. AND its a shame but i still love him.

KingKane wrote:I love him very much. AND its a shame but i still love him.

that's the main thing, love him and enjoy him

That's the important thing, that you love each other

Well i dont think he loves me lol hahahaha only when i have food cuddles or walksz hahaha

Ah, but those food, cuddles & walks times are very good!

Absolutely adorable! Love his colour and his gorgeous eyes. Sooo cute

What a beautiful boy!

Maria90 wrote:Absolutely adorable! Love his colour and his gorgeous eyes. Sooo cute

The colour is striking, but not allowed in the breed standard.

What a gorgeous boy, and so happy:D