im new and need some help please.

hello,
i have 2 staffies, both rescues and brother and sister. a few nights ago we had a bad situation in my house. my partner had a meltdown of sorts, she has been under a lot of pressure and just snapped, this melt down included a lot of shouting and also some kicking and punching of my front room door. my boy staffie (jasper) reacted in a way he never has, he went for her, she was on the floor and he went to bite her face but she managed to get her arm in the way, he did not lock on but did do some damage to her forearm, he immediately stopped. this was very out of character for him. i have 3 kids (including a 8 month old) and he has never shoiwed this type of aggression before.

after the incident my girlfriend went to hospital and to be honest i was in shock of the melt down i had just witnessed and also the fact that my staff had reacted that way. needless to say he was separated from the family that night and i immediately the following morning called every rspca and battersea like company i could find. i was truly shocked to find that nobody would help, as he had bitten they just were not interested. i knew in my heart of hearts what had to be done, but i needed to be told what to do, i love this dog, my kids love this dog. after a few calls i got through to a staffy rescue who indeed told me what i did not want to here. that i would have to put my dog down.

due to financial difficulties i have had to put off the putting down until Wednesday, i know i could have taken down the rspca and had it done for free, but i didnt think that was right. if i had to do this then i needed to pay for it to be done, and pay for it somewhere i could trust them to treat him with respect once it was done.

so this has left me in a hard place, my dog is still here, and it is breaking everything in me to see him and know that in 2 days he will not be here. i cant help but think that due to the fact that my partner acted the way she did that he may have thought she was a danger to my kids (he is very protective of them). there was so many factors about what happened that night that are not normal in this house. and i wish this wasn't happening.

everyone i have spoken to has told me he needs to be put down, im here to ask is there any charity that i have not tried, any route i havent been down, any other solution to this. or am i just in denial and am not seeing the reality of the situation. my 7 year old went into school and mentioned what happened the day after it happened and someone at the school has notified authorities aswell, and they obviously want the dog away from kids but are happy with the way we are dealing with it......that im going to take my beloved dog to the vets to have him killed...killed for something i believe should never have happened.......killed for what i believe was nothing more than him protecting my kids.

so im here as a last resort, i have realised im probably going to get the same response here as i am everywhere else, but if genuine staffy lovers tell me then i think it will make this a little easier.

sorry for my long intro and question, im at the end of the road and still dont know how im gonna have to do on wednesday.

thanks for any help!

Hi welcome to the forum.

I'm going to say the opposite to what you have already been told I'm afraid. With the limited amount of info you've written I obviously don't know the whole story of what must have been an extremely frightening scene but is this the only time something of this nature has happened ?

It was an extreme reaction to the shouting etc but not entirely unexpected. My girl will stand between me and my boys if we play fight and bark at us to stop so as you can see, they will pick up on tension or situations and react. In normal circumstances barking would be all they will do but, again, I obviously wasn't there to see what happened.

There is a list of rescue centres we have here that would be worth calling before you make that fateful trip to the vets to see if they can help in any way, it would be tragic to have Jasper PTS if there was another way

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t10833-rescue-centres-list#155897

-Ian- wrote:Hi welcome to the forum.

I'm going to say the opposite to what you have already been told I'm afraid. With the limited amount of info you've written I obviously don't know the whole story of what must have been an extremely frightening scene but is this the only time something of this nature has happened ?

It was an extreme reaction to the shouting etc but not entirely unexpected. My girl will stand between me and my boys if we play fight and bark at us to stop so as you can see, they will pick up on tension or situations and react. In normal circumstances barking would be all they will do but, again, I obviously wasn't there to see what happened.

There is a list of rescue centres we have here that would be worth calling before you make that fateful trip to the vets to see if they can help in any way, it would be tragic to have Jasper PTS if there was another way

https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t10833-rescue-centres-list#155897

thanks for your speedy reply. this is the first time he has ever bitten, and the situation was so different from normal in this house, she has never acted like the way she did. my jasper will indeed stand inbetween me and my kids while play fighting and bark if anyone shouts, which is not often. i will call everyone on the list and thank you so much for providing it. the worst bit about all of this is being told by the autorities that he has to go, they dont know the situation or my dog, he is a loving boy.

I'm sorry but i absolutely have to disagree with everyone who's told you he needs putting down. From what i can read of what you've said, you were getting verbally assaulted and staffies are incredibly loyal, perceptive dogs who are very person orientated and this appears like a protective reaction to try and keep you safe.

I would consider if you think he's a risk at all very carefully and if you think he needs rehoming then try willing fosterers who will have him until he can be adopted. It really would be a shame if he was put to sleep with out exhausting other avenues first.

Keep us updated

edit: i just re-read about the authorities cornering you into this, am sorry, this is an horrible situation

Sealpig wrote:I'm sorry but i absolutely have to disagree with everyone who's told you he needs putting down. From what i can read of what you've said, you were getting verbally assaulted and staffies are incredibly loyal, perceptive dogs who are very person orientated and this appears like a protective reaction to try and keep you safe.

I would consider if you think he's a risk at all very carefully and if you think he needs rehoming then try willing fosterers who will have him until he can be adopted. It really would be a shame if he was put to sleep with out exhausting other avenues first.

Keep us updated

edit: i just re-read about the authorities cornering you into this, am sorry, this is an horrible situation

i dont think he is a risk to anyone, if he hadnt gone for her throat then i would never have even entertained any of this from any authorities or anyone else. all my girlfriend keeps asking me is "if it was the kids he went for then this would be different" and it would, because my kids wouldnt act that way. i feel like im dying inside, torn between what i think and what im being told. the dam school making themselves busy and informing authories had put a dead line on all of this which makes it harder. i dont know what to do, but if this has to be done i dont want someone else taking him away and doing it. i know it has to be me.

I echo the sentiments above. It just sounds like he was reacting to the situation which I can imagine would have been very scary for the poor dog. I really hope you can find some other way.

I believe the dog was protecting the kids i dont believe he needs put down if this is the only incident he could indeed be rehomed with one solo owner he could be of course be assessed beforehand by a behaviourist. I do realise the stress you must be under it may also take some time for the dog to trust a woman again. I hope in the end its a good outcome.

Completely disagree with him being put down also! What area are you in? I could recommend a behaviourist to come and help you! This is so out of character for him, and he was probably really scared of your partner and feeling concerned and protective of himself and his family. If he has never shown you any cause for concern before, get help from a behaviourist to help you all move forward from this. Please don't put him to sleep.

I work for a small rehab/rehome centre in a Devon and may be able to help

Hear hear Rach,I also agree that your dog shouldnt be pts!! its too drastic if its only been once and under the circumstances of why it happened.It would be a different scenario if you couldnt pin point anything that caused it. I hope we hear good news from you soon xx

hia from me and sasha i can only agree with what has been said,please dont have him pts,i hope Rach can help

I'm with the others that I don't think this is cause to have your dog PTS. Animals react to situations and also respond to energy levels of others. If you were in shock at your girlfriend's melt down, imagine how your dog felt to witness it, not understanding what was happening but sensing that you were in danger.

I can see that you are in an incredibly difficult situations as once the authorities get involved it can be nigh on impossible to get them to back off, especially where children are involved.

My fingers are crossed that you can find a rescue place. I would ask Danaher but I know that we are completely full and have a waiting list, which wouldn't help in your timeframe. I hope you find something in time, I really do.

Sorry but I disagree with having him PTS!!!!! Please do not do it! I'm sure you'll find a rescue for him!

Authorities pee me off!

You're in a difficult situation, thanks to the bad behaviour of others and the inevitable meddling from people who have nothing better to do than mind other people's business. Good on you for trying to get the best result for your dog, though, and you'd do well to take note of the advice given by others on this thread.

To add to what's been said, your description that suggests the dog was doing only what might be expected of a loyal, protective dog put into a stressful situation through no fault of its own. The fact he bit and let go shows that it was not a serious attempt to harm, only to neutralize the threat. Once the dog realised the danger had passed, as he saw it, he stopped.

I don't know the details but I'd imagine the authorities can't do anything without an assessment of your dog's temperament. I'd be very surprised if they could act on a single bite delivered under provocation, even with their inevitable ignorance and bias of the breed and dogs in general. Obviously you have to be very careful around kids and the decision is entirely up to you, but I can only repeat what I've said, which is based on what you say I don't see the dog posing any more danger to the kids than it did before. And despite me straying OT, it's pretty rich of your GF to criticise you for putting the kids at risk when the whole situation was her fault in the first place.

thank you all for your input. after days now researching and taking on board some of your comments i have cancelled the appointment to put him to sleep. i have read that in similar cases to this others had used a muzzle and also had the dog away from children (often in large cages, dont worry i am not that cruel). so i have been researching muzzles and found several options that allow a dog to pant drink ect, and have also purchased 4 baby gates to section off the back quater of my house, this compromises of my dining area and kitchen.
 while i am very uncomfortable with any of this, any authorities which wish to challenge my decision to not pts will be met with all my efforts regarding the muzzle, separated area, and start of dog training. they can certainly come round and do any assessments they wish as this dog has never hurt a fly untill this incident, and i am overly confident he will pass anything they can throw at him.
 obviously i hope all of this will be temporary and in time he will be able to rejoin my kids and get rid of the muzzle (which i dont think he needs) but i have to make every effort where the authorities are concerned.
 im so glad i joined here and posted my situation as your kindness and info has helped me to find other options and find the will needed to fight this, it is very scary when people like the school and child protection threaten to step in, but i will not allow them to force me into a situation i know in my heart is not needed. i know he was in his mind protecting my kids, i know he could have killed her if he really wanted to, but he didnt. and nobody is taking my jasper away without a serious fight on my behalf.

thank you again to everyone who has commented, if things dont work out i may contact some of you regarding your kind offers.

i will keep you updated as the situation progresses.

Sounds like a good decision. Have a think about whether you need the muzzle as well as all the other measures, though, and if you decide you do make sure you introduce it gradually, otherwise it could cause more problems than it solves.

Fantastic news. In so happy that tomorrow is cancelled. He has been your trusty companion and you obviously love him. I really think he poses no threat to anyone he was just in a very scary situation. I really am happy for you both x

So pleased to read that you're looking at these options. With time I'm sure confidence in Jasper will return

any changes as above do so gradually so pleased ur not having jasper pts

Good news! On muzzles, I'd recommend the Baskerville Ultra. It fits a staffie well and allows enough freedom to drink, pant, etc. When you introduce it, try and make it nice. Pop it on, take it off and give him a treat. Repeat that several times, then start giving treats through the muzzle (the ultra lets you do this).

Re crates, many people on here use them. Again, make it super nice. Feed him in there, avoid leaving him very long to start off with, and leave him with a stuffed Kong or something.

The other thing you might want to think about is consulting a good behaviourist. They will be able to come and give you a proper assessment of the whole family interaction with both dogs and will be able to give you targetted guidance and, importantly, support afterwards. They're not always cheap but then having a dog pts isn't either, and the outcome is of course so much better. Depending on where you are, someone here might have a recommendation, or your vet may know of someone he can recommend. Failing that, I'd look on the APBC or APDT websites, at most members of both organisations are usually pretty good

http://www.apbc.org.uk/
http://www.apdt.co.uk/

Good luck!

LizP wrote:Good news! On muzzles, I'd recommend the Baskerville Ultra. It fits a staffie well and allows enough freedom to drink, pant, etc. When you introduce it, try and make it nice. Pop it on, take it off and give him a treat. Repeat that several times, then start giving treats through the muzzle (the ultra lets you do this).

Re crates, many people on here use them. Again, make it super nice. Feed him in there, avoid leaving him very long to start off with, and leave him with a stuffed Kong or something.

The other thing you might want to think about is consulting a good behaviourist. They will be able to come and give you a proper assessment of the whole family interaction with both dogs and will be able to give you targetted guidance and, importantly, support afterwards. They're not always cheap but then having a dog pts isn't either, and the outcome is of course so much better. Depending on where you are, someone here might have a recommendation, or your vet may know of someone he can recommend. Failing that, I'd look on the APBC or APDT websites, at most members of both organisations are usually pretty good

http://www.apbc.org.uk/
http://www.apdt.co.uk/

Good luck!

thanks for your reply, i went out tonight and got that exact muzzle, ill do as you say and slowly introduce and make it very nice. i have contacted vet and got some numbers so will be getting a behavioral specialist, thanks again.

Just saw your thread and so happy you decided not to pts otherwise well behaved dog .I'm quite sure my peppa and other dogs can react exactly the same way in such extreme circumstances and convinced he just try to protect you and the kids. You need to be able to control the dog and mostly to show authorities you took measurements but do your best to make sure this situation will never happen again for everybody's sake.

In my eyes reading all the other comments,, I don't think you should have to get him put down,, he was only protecting you & your kids whilst ur crazy ex girlfriend is kicking and smacking the door.
I also think that it should get put down cos u never know when he will turn on ur kids.

Just read the thread! I'm so happy you cancelled the appointment! Introduce all them precautions gradually, like Dogface mentioned, it could cause more problems otherwise! You made the right decision, you pooch was only protecting, I'm sure it was a scary situation for you all, but your pooch was confused as well and instinct says 'protect my owner'.

yay so glad you've cancelled the appointment. I'm sure your boy will do everything he can to make it up to you and give you loads of love xx

again thank you all for your comments and help. the one thing i will say in this whole nightmare situation is how let down i feel by all the big named charities and dog rescues and even some of the smaller staffy rescues.

when i contacted them just after the incident, i was distraught, the thought that one of these phone calls could end with someone coming to get my jasper and taking him away. 99% of these calls ended with the same outcome "ill have to put him to sleep", not one of them mentioned anything about any training or other options (like muzzle and separation ect.). these companies and charities are the people anyone would call when things like this happen, it is a very upsetting thought that they give no advice like i have received here, and how many poor dogs are put to sleep because of it. i understand that most of these companies do a brilliant job and go out of there way for our dogs, but i now wonder how many dogs are abandoned because of the lack of advice, how many are needlessly  put to sleep.

on a brighter note, my jasper actually seems to enjoy his muzzle, we have been playing with it for most of the morning. as for the sleeping arrangements he was a bit upset last night, being locked in back half of house (he normally sleeps on my feet), but after an hour or so he got into his new bed and slept (i didnt lol, felt so bad). but things certainly seem to be going the right way a lot quicker than i was expecting. thank you all again, i will become an active member here, if it wasnt for your comments i feel tonight would have been my poor jaspers last. THANK YOU!

Yay!!!

No dog deserves to be PTS for one incident.

So glad you are working things out.

They are quick learners and will adjust so long as it's not too drastic a change fairly happily.

Just so pleased that this is the outcome and not the other option

my staffies wrote:
when i contacted them just after the incident, i was distraught, the thought that one of these phone calls could end with someone coming to get my jasper and taking him away. 99% of these calls ended with the same outcome "ill have to put him to sleep", not one of them mentioned anything about any training or other options (like muzzle and separation ect.). these companies and charities are the people anyone would call when things like this happen, it is a very upsetting thought that they give no advice like i have received here, and how many poor dogs are put to sleep because of it. i understand that most of these companies do a brilliant job and go out of there way for our dogs, but i now wonder how many dogs are abandoned because of the lack of advice, how many are needlessly  put to sleep.

It could well be that seeing there are kids involved, these organisations are, understandably, covering their arses and erring on the side of caution. It's difficult to judge a situation over the phone and if they'd advised you to keep the dog and something did happen to the kids, they would be in a bad position if you chose to make this public. You could almost imagine the headline in the papers, "XYZ Staffie Rescue Told Family to Keep Savage Dog!" Of course, based on what you said we all know the dog's not savage and that it's incredibly unlikely he will ever show human aggression in the future, but you can see where these guys are coming from.

Anyhow, you've made the right decision and it sounds like it's working out great. I'm sure you'll look back on it in years to come and breathe a sigh of relief that you didn't take the 'easy' way out.

You are so right, Dogface. The press LOVES a story about how someone got it wong, particularly big organisations like the RSPCA.

At least you now know where to come for a sensible answer - here!