Alfie's Rehab Journey

Sorry may be a bit long winded in places. Hope it makes sense!

Background:
We lost our elderly dog 4 years ago, she was not a staff, but she was another rescue dog. We didn’t immediately start looking for another dog as it felt wrong to us to “replace” her straight away. Then our daughter came along and it didn’t seem the right time. I began really missing  a dog again about a year ago, but hubby said its easier without one, a big tie etc. All true of course but well worth it, anyway I left it for a bit, but kept mentioning it. Then I caught him looking at rehoming sites    We started visiting a few centres with no particular breed in mind. There were a lot of staffies around, but I admit (never knowing anyone who had one) I was worried about the damage one could do to a child if it attacked. Please bear in mind we were going through the rescue route, so not knowing a dog from a pup we had to be very careful what we brought into our home. Also just from their strength knocking the kids flying generally around the home. However the more I saw of them the more I really wanted one!    The problem was a lot had no known background being strays, we were not going to take the risk and neither would the centres.
After being let down by a private seller with another dog, long story short we fell for a chocolate brown staff but seller had not told his kids! I said it was up to him but they might not forgive him if she just disappeared  with no chance to even say goodbye!   He told them 15 mins before we were due to collect her and of course they were heartbroken and shocked, so the wife said she couldn’t go! About 6 weeks later they asked if we still wanted her as it was not working out and they still had no time for her! However this was after we got involved with Alfie and was 2 days before we were due to collect him so had to decline. Hope she found a great home.

We first saw Alfie on a rescue site online. After enquiring, we learnt he was still at his own home, but they were moving to a flat and had no time for him. They had already rehomed their German Shepherd. The rescue had seen him advertised, Free. They contacted his owners and said, if free anyone could get him and be used for baiting etc. They said they would find suitable owners and do home checks. A few people showed interest, but we were chosen    We visited him at the house and he was very excitable! He mobbed us when we walked in, jumping around our heads when we sat down. He had no collar on so trying to contain him was near impossible. However the owner shouted at him a few times and my hubby said she banged her foot down on his backend    (I missed this). I was very shocked at how underweight he was and asked her why that was. She said he had suddenly lost weight and didn’t know why, so I requested he was taken to a vet to find out before we had him and she agreed. Her own opinion was that he needed worming, begging the question, why hadn’t she done it before he got to that state then?! They said he had an ongoing ear problem, one side his ear canal is narrower and as air can’t circulate as well it occasionally gets sore, but been ok for ages. I looked at the ear and told her it was inflamed now! I could see it was swollen and very red and he was holding his head at a slight tilt. He was fed on Asda tinned meat with some biscuits left out all day. They had a 4yr old son, who wasn’t there, and they proudly told us he rode Alfie like a horse! Because of lack of time they only walked him once a week!! We were told he was good dog, great with kids, ignores other dogs when out, but often wees a little bit in excitement at visitors. He was 22 months old and when they moved before, he was around a year old and he did both messes indoors for about a month afterwards so he may revert back to that. We said we were very interested, pending vet opinion. Once he calmed a bit we could see he was such a lovely little fella just needing some love and good care. We texted and spoke on the phone a couple of times during the week. They wormed him and said he had started to fill out already and that the vet gave him some ear treatment. To be fair she did say he had to go back to a vet and did we want her to keep him until the treatment was finished or take him the following weekend as organised. Well we just wanted to get him out of there asap, It wasn’t the worst place in the world by any means but far from the best! We told the rescue how the visit went and they spoke to the vet to confirm they went and what they said was true. The vet said he was slightly underweight but nothing to worry about and probably was the worming issue.
We paid the rescue for him and collected him a week after first seeing him. He had started to fill out a bit, still very thin but you couldn’t see every muscle fibre like a diagram of under the skin!

This is the day we brought him home, looking better than the week before!!



Home
Issues:
Body condition
messing indoors
Weeing when visitors come
Over Excited mobbing guests
Anxious when out

We collected him early Saturday morning and brought him home. We didn’t take him out that day as he was so stressed by the move. He loved the garden as much more room than he had (about 15 foot of muddy grass, which would have been ok if exercised out of the house too, but wasn‘t) plus we have a few trees and bushes to run around and hide behind. He played with toys etc but you could hear from his breathing, even just laying on his bed, he was stressed. He drank so much water that day too, dry mouth nerves!

Next weekend he will have been in our family for 4 months   

Body condition.
We didn’t have asda tinned food and decided to put him straight on Barking Heads complete, Salmon. Luckily it didn’t upset his stomach and he enjoyed it. He began to slowly build up and it was when his coat was shining and smooth, we realised how bad his coat had been. It was dull and lots would fall out when we stroked him at their house, but he was hardly shedding a hair now and gleaming. From hearing about it here, we also give him coconut oil.

We took him to our vets who said he had a fungal infection in his ear and has been sorted for now, obviously going to be a reoccurring health issue we will keep an eye on.

Messing Indoors
He was good and quiet at night from the beginning but did both messes that night. We didn’t tell him off, just cleared it up with no fuss. I think he did a poo twice more that week, then never again.

Weeing when visitors come
He actually only did this 3 times here and it was droplets really and in the early days.

Over Excited mobbing guests
Firstly, although he has his collar off in the evening/night, it is put on in the morning and stays on all day. This means we have something to hold him by if needed. I think being walked everyday has calmed his energy levels a bit. However, he still gets excited. He will now run up to the guests and may put his paws up on them, we tell him down and he does, but he may still do this a few times. We also tell people to ignore him until he has all paws on the ground and calm. Not everyone feels they have to listen to us on this! They then moan when he jumps all over them on the settee! I will hold him and make him sit quietly beside me for a while too. He does calm and settle (or pretends to) but then goes over excited to them again. Lol. We also distract him with Kongs, which works great. In all he is still excitable but much calmer than he was.

Anxious when out
Leading to;  Strong lead pulling
                    Going for other dogs
                     No recall

He was alert to everything, people, dogs, bags, a stone or lump of mud! He would not sniff around or wee or poo. He rarely used his nose, unless he could smell a dog close by. He was not interested in smelling where they had been or marked. He would just pull like a train, all the while alert looking for danger. We began to feel the “Walked once a week” may have been an exaggeration! The previous owners gave us a choker collar and said if he pulls this will choke him until he cant breathe then he stops pulling for a bit!   That went straight in the bin. We got him a harness and found he was very slightly better (at least he could breathe!). We had a trainer come round to help with this. On the phone she said it may be a case of if he was walked with the GSD then he may be lacking confidence walking on his own. When we took him out with her though she said “This dog has not been walked and socialised with the outside world!” His breathing, not sniffing anything and not weeing or pooing on a walk were due to the fact he was so tense and nervous. This made a lot of sense, if he was not relaxed he didn’t feel safe enough to let his guard down to stop and wee etc. For the same reason his nerves would not let him be able to accept any treats while out, even though he would run to you for them at home. She recommended some herbal drops to help calm him and to use a Dogmatic head collar for the pulling.
Well we have been using the drops around 4 weeks, she suggested may take 3 months worth or bit more. The Dogmatic head collar was lovely but unfortunately Alfie was between sizes so no good. We now have a Halti, he still pulls but not to the same strength. He still will not do anything on a walk, even when we have been out for a few hours, he will wait to do it in the garden. We can now manage to play ball with him on the long lead as he can  relax his “look outs” for a short period to be able to chase a ball. However if a dog is on the horizon the toys are forgotten immediately   .
It turns out Alfie does not “ignore” other dogs when out, far from it. He is trying to spot them all the time. He goes very still and gives the stare of “come any closer and I’ll have you!” Most dogs and owners ignore him, and me telling them he not friendly to dogs! He has gone for a few of these dogs, no damage as I have him, but very lucky not to have a dog turn on him in retaliation and a full on fight start. I promised his previous owner a text update on how he was settling in after a week. I mentioned he had gone for the few dogs we had met at that time and she replied “He is usually ok, growl at him if he is being stupid”! Obviously he was ok with their GSD but we don’t know the relationship, was he dominated etc, or is it the fact he is scared on his own? We didn’t meet any dogs when out with the trainer but she recommended  avoiding dogs for the time being and concentrate getting him used to the outside world first. Easier said than done. Only today there was an older man walking two little fluffy dogs (very cute I have to say). He put one on a lead and left the other one off. I asked him to put it on as mine was not dog friendly. He told me to walk past (on a canal path) as it was ok. It started to approach us, so I repeated Alfie would go for it if it came up to him. He said just walk forward and it will move away, of course as is always the case when an owner says these things, the dog didn’t move. I again said he will go for him. This time he said that’s ok it will teach him a lesson!!    I said, but you don’t want him bitten and injured!! I just don’t get people that don’t heed a warning their pet could be attacked! Anyway I got halfway past with Alfie wide eyed staring at it, when it came up to his bum. I calmly said your dog is going to be bitten, get it away, but he didn’t seem bothered. Alfie’s response was to freeze half down on his back legs looking round (I had him on the halti so hopefully he wouldn‘t have been able to lunge at it). Maybe the man thought the Halti was a muzzle? As the dog approached his face, I knew this was the danger part, I managed to call and drag him away and thankfully the dog didn’t follow.
Rachel I’m not good at explaining it but do you, or anyone else, read Alfie’s response as fear? It certainly looked that way to me.
However I saw it as a teeny tiny success as he did have an experience of a dog sniff his bum and he didn’t get the chance to lunge at it. Hey you have to take you positives where you can!

When walking, Alfie typically will like to be on the end of the long lead on look out and pulling for all he is worth. From the start we tried calling him and he would not even look back at us. As already said he had no interest in treats while out so couldn’t use them. Eventually he would half turn his head, we praised him lots. Then he would make eye contact, even more praise. Now we have got as far as if we have a ball in our hands and say “Alfie whats this?” he runs back to us. He is praised and given the ball, which sometimes he only carries a few feet before dropping. I have been practicing this for nearly 2 weeks now.

To sum him up, we have a lot of on going issues out on walks, but at home he mostly a dream. We all love him to bits and he loves snuggle cuddles on our laps and having us give him attention and playing with him. Love my Alfie snuggle bum!  

Aww what I great story, he has really come on,well done for giving him the home he deserves   xx

this is amazing!! You've come so far with him already and I'm certain you'll get to where you'll need to be, just takes some trial and error. 4 months into working with Biscuit she hadn't changed at all, other than knowin a few more commands. You're definitely on the right track

His response to unknown dogs sounds so much like Biscuit's!! She's fine with "family" and dogs that she's met a few times, but will never tolerate unknown dogs getting in her face. This is where I would recommended very slow muzzle training with Alfie, now that I know Bis can't bite another dog when they get close I relax more, and so does she. She only wears it is doggy populated areas, but it's helped both of our confidence. She reminds me of an anxious horse that I used to spend time with by the way the prances with her head high, constantly looking for "danger," that too has gotten better, but unfortunately you can never go back and replace that socialization period as a pup, and some things just have to be managed rather than cured.

I think you're doing so, so well with him! Keep going, and update in here as much as possible! It'll keep you going when you've had a tough day with him, seeing how much he's progressed, even now when it's still early days

P.S Saz, didn't Daisy have some behavioural and health problems on arrival? Would love to hear her story

Thanks Saz I agree with Rach, love to hear more about Daisy's journey. I know she has had skin problems and you changed to raw and any training issues etc.   

Rachel33 wrote: this is amazing!! You've come so far with him already and I'm certain you'll get to where you'll need to be, just takes some trial and error. 4 months into working with Biscuit she hadn't changed at all, other than knowin a few more commands. You're definitely on the right track

His response to unknown dogs sounds so much like Biscuit's!! She's fine with "family" and dogs that she's met a few times, but will never tolerate unknown dogs getting in her face. This is where I would recommended very slow muzzle training with Alfie, now that I know Bis can't bite another dog when they get close I relax more, and so does she. She only wears it is doggy populated areas, but it's helped both of our confidence. She reminds me of an anxious horse that I used to spend time with by the way the prances with her head high, constantly looking for "danger," that too has gotten better, but unfortunately you can never go back and replace that socialization period as a pup, and some things just have to be managed rather than cured.

I think you're doing so, so well with him! Keep going, and update in here as much as possible! It'll keep you going when you've had a tough day with him, seeing how much he's progressed, even now when it's still early days

Thank you so much Rachel, makes me feel much better. I was worried it was taking me forever to help him, so encouraging to hear about Biscuit. In lots of ways it feels like we have had him forever   , but as you say 4 months is not so long. I still haven't got round to taking him to P.A.H to get him a muzzle fitted, but I will. As you say I can relax a bit more and then, in time, see if he can tolerate a dog being near. A friend with a 2yr retriever said we could try walking them side by side. Wont until he used to a muzzle though.

Not at all, rehab is a very gradual process, if you rushed it you'd just end up taking 5 steps back. It definitely sounds like fear to me but just keep in mind personality/breed.. Terriers aren't known for their patience or thinking before they act so would recommend the muzzle for the first few walks with the retriever in case his fear turns into a snap. As he's lived with the GSD, it would appear that he can do dog which is a good thing, I hoped that Biscuit having lots of doggy friends may help her in meeting new random dogs but it never has, but she does get to enjoy the company of others now, she's got 6 friends that she plays with regularly. If only you were closer, I think their fear of the world might bring them together and then they could be friends lol!

Another great read. You have come a long way in such a very short time. It just goes to show that with love and patience an awfull lot can be achieved.

I really should stop reading these at work though   

Rachel33 wrote:Not at all, rehab is a very gradual process, if you rushed it you'd just end up taking 5 steps back. It definitely sounds like fear to me but just keep in mind personality/breed.. Terriers aren't known for their patience or thinking before they act so would recommend the muzzle for the first few walks with the retriever in case his fear turns into a snap. As he's lived with the GSD, it would appear that he can do dog which is a good thing, I hoped that Biscuit having lots of doggy friends may help her in meeting new random dogs but it never has, but she does get to enjoy the company of others now, she's got 6 friends that she plays with regularly. If only you were closer, I think their fear of the world might bring them together and then they could be friends lol!

Yes I would definitely use the muzzle first, especially as there isn't a vocal warning. Aw for them to be friends would have been great!
I do keep thinking, he has lived with another dog there must be hope!

-Ian- wrote:Another great read. You have come a long way in such a very short time. It just goes to show that with love and patience an awfull lot can be achieved.

I really should stop reading these at work though   

Thank you Ian. It helps to write it down actually as sometimes you think not much has progressed. Now get back to work       

Well done flowerbud and Alfie     

Thank you Claire!

Actually had another move forward!
Alfie would not touch any treats when out, due to stress. I have got him to take one before but he just let it drop from his mouth, even little doggy choc drops! Tried sausage too, he ate the tiniest bit but no more. Well, my friend made her dog some Liver cake and gave some to me. I have small pieces in the fridge and some in the freezer. He has managed to eat it when out practising recall on the lead. Its weird he doesn't seem that excited for it but takes it and eats it. Will have to take some other treats and alternate them with the liver cake to see if he will accept them too now.

   yay!! Biscuit's training treat is cheddar cheese.. she will do ANYTHING for it!

At least that's quick and easy! Lol Will try that too   

Well done to you both

Daisy's was more health but I will post her story xx

Sazzle wrote:Daisy's was more health but I will post her story xx

  

Will try and do it tomorrow xx

you all great owners!! that all i got to say

As thanks Steve!   

Just to update Alfie's journey, although this has been on another topic.
https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t52431-help

Ok so Alfie was on my lap, my 3yr daughter sitting next to us. She was stroking him and then he lunged and grabbed her hand!! No damage and said it didn't hurt but it was definitely a warning. I saw it happen and immediately said NO and pushed him onto the floor and put him on his bed. There was no sound, though I was watching him as he was licking his lips. I have noticed he does this with her even though she is not all over him, he can look uncomfortable with her. He never sits on her lap as he does my 10yr old son or hubby and me and she is not as into him so she doesn't ever bother him. She was very quietly and nicely stroking him. It's worried me now, as she did nothing wrong   
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We have spoken again to our daughter about leaving him alone (she does anyway), and she is giving him all his meals and treats during the day.

Update:
Today I met a friend and her golden retriever, Bob. Alfie wore his muzzle, been practicing at home with it but he still hated it and clawed at his face trying to get it off a few times. Did when we first came out of the door, so had it on really tight. Cant trust him with other dogs so necessary at the moment for peace of mind and safety of my friends dogs, yet I also think he cant be feeling his best wearing it anyway. Lesser of two evils though. Hopefully we can safely introduce dog meetings and eventually long lead play    hoping to not need it in the end, though think we always need to be very careful.
Bob was very calm and well behaved. Alfie was all stressy at first, trying to get to him and almost hyperventilating    It was only a 20 min walk and the dogs didn't have contact Just us walking along with our dogs close to us. After 10 mins Alfie was much calmer and was even pulling a bit less (with his little face I just cant put the Halti on with the muzzle and he always pulls worse on the collar and harness & double lead). He was watching Bob less, looking over just now and then. For the last 5 mins he seemed to visible relax that bit more. Bob was the perfect choice for him as he was so laid back and hardly interested in Alfie just walked on regardless.
We are meeting again weds pm and hope to keep it up when we can. Obviously would not trust him from this, but its a small step in the right direction and I was really pleased with him.
As I fully expected, Just that very short walk with another dog exhausted him! All that mental and emotional (fear, excitement) wore him out and he just flaked out on the floor when we got back    
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Sounds great Hun   xx

Thanks Saz x

Sounds like you're making so much progress I admire all of you that have rescued dogs with issues such a great thing to do how is Alfie and your 3 year old? Do you think he's a bit wary because the previous owners let their child jump all over him? By the way your 3 year old sounds like a lovely little thing not many kids would understand about leaving the dog alone and stroking nicely what a little angel! X

Debs01 wrote:Sounds like you're making so much progress I admire all of you that have rescued dogs with issues such a great thing to do  how is Alfie and your 3 year old?  Do you think he's a bit wary because the previous owners let their child jump all over him?  By the way your 3 year old sounds like a lovely little thing not many kids would understand about leaving the dog alone and stroking nicely what a little angel! X

Thanks Debs she is really good with leaving him alone. She is the one who mostly gives him his meals and some treats. She also throws the odd ball for him, getting him to sit first. Only when I'm right next to her.

As for dog walking, we have been doing little and often. Most days we manage to meet for the 15 minutes of our walks with Bob the dog. However he will still has the odd non friendly lunge at him or gives him the death stare   so not much progress there. I have taken off the muzzle and put back the halti as he was so stressed with it on.

Hey! How's Alfie getting on? X

Hi! Thursday we had the trainer out. We took him out for a walk and she recommended we stop using the harness as he pushing into it more. Instead we tried the double lead on Halti and collar. We found before that anything on his collar sent him into steam train mode lol, so its normally on Halti and harness, but I have to say he was much better. We gone back to basics and doing lots of circling back if he pulls. She again said how you could immediately tell he wasn't socialised or taken out with previous owners, as he was so stressed and mega alert for anything scary(still). This time we passed a few dogs (last time saw none!   ) She saw how he was and how silent he was when they were closer. She said he means it and often the silent ones were the ones that would bite. She said to do circle work with approaching dogs when he reacts, laying down etc. We soon got to try this but it made him worse, my theory was that to do a circle he has to turn his back on the very scary thing approaching him (I couldn't do it with a spider!). She said he really shut down and still says its fear aggression. So she said to do the circles if the dog is at some distance away but if we have to pass, to continue as I was doing which is to walk on by like its nothing. He got all stressy walking by a garden with yappy dogs behind the 6 foot fence which was about 6 foot from the path. We did lots of calm circles until he began to be less stressy and the owners called their noisy dogs in lol. As she said its a good way to practice with secure out of the way dogs, though annoying for the neighbours!
Another thing she said to stop was the treats. As you may remember Alfie was unable to eat when out and had zero interest in his fave treats. Well at quiet times he has been able to  accept them. My friend Sue (another one lol) with the retriever Bob we walk with had started giving Alfie a treat when we met. The trainer said to stop that, it was fine when teaching sit etc but no good for psychology. We don't want to be treating him when in that heightened state.
She is coming back in July.
We actually came across a cat on a walk on Friday. As it was sat still, staring at the mad dog, apart from arching its back now and then, I practiced walking past it (10 feet away). Whenever Alfie reacted I calmly turned and walked in the other direction then calmly walked back, after I think 4 turns he just continued to walked past! Mega good! However I know if the cat had moved it would have been very different. When hubby took him out he said the pulling was much less. Im making him go out with her next time as he does tend to keep pulling him back like he is on a piece of elastic, which makes him worse, but im training him too! I started to teach Alfie "watch me" and he is getting it, but I agree with the trainer when she said he is unable to hear you when we are out as he is that scared. It cant hurt though.