Sophie sick again - sorry

Morning all, I won't bore you with her tummy history, you have all been very helpful and most of you are probably up to speed. We stopped the Vionate and immediately she stopped being sick.

She stayed on the chicken, potato, carrots and peas and she went back to not being sick, which would point to the Vionate. About three days ago, we intoduced fish4dogs. The small bite complete food. Just a handful to be used for training treats. She loved them

Yesterday, after a long discussion with the manufacturer we reintroduced Zilkene which she used to have as a pup ( I actually typed kitten) I went through her history and we checked every ingredient for her particular needs. She is getting more and more hyper and the lack of treat training means she is developing bad habits. Also, her fur loss may be stress related the vet thinks.

This morning, she was sick again, back to her usual style.

We will stop the Zilkene and give it a few days and try the fish4dogs again. She had the complete food and a couple of fish jerky treats from them.

We have actually ordered both oth these items, one to be collected from our local pet shop today, and one to be delivered (don't ask)!

If she can't cope with the fish4dogs, what on earth do I use as a training treat as she really needs a firm hand at the moment?

I know we can go down the raw diet, but if the chicken / potato route is working we are happy for her to stay on that. We thought the fish4dogs would at least give us san alternative.

What is the likelyhood of it being either that or the Zilkene? She really does need to calm down at the mo

She is turning into a teenager

Aww poor Soph

I would think it's the Zilkene rather than the F4Ds as she was fine for a few days with the F4Ds and the sickness only started after you introduced the Zilkene.

If you think she's stressed then perhaps you'd be better trying something that she doesn't have to ingest like a DAP diffuser or spray?

Hi Gladriel, many thanks for the prompt response. She is so hyper (always has been). She isn't too bad indoors, but when we take her out she is getting so excited she is becoming uncontrollable and starts jumping up and has now started biting her lead when she gets over excited.

It is very hard to regain any focus and is starting to be a problem. One of the reasons we are hoping the fish4dogs will work for her as trying to train her without being able to treat her to get her to concentrate is proving difficult and we need to nip this in the bud.

She was taking a 'valuable' toy with her which was getting her to focus on something but the other day every time she lost got over excited she just threw the toy on the ground and turned on her lead.

It seems to be more exhuberance than any thing else, but it has obviously got to be stopped pronto, hence our desire to be able to treat her.

She has had a small breakfast (as usual) of her chicken / potato / veg mix this morning but no Zilkene.

We will look into it again if it is likely to give positive results.

Many thanks, will keep you posted ><

Sorry, i cant be of more help, but has you vet checked her for mite, im just wondering if this could be the cause of her fur loss. They can get mite if their immune system is down

How much exercise does she get? Does she get any hard, fast running to burn a bit of energy?

Could you try training with games/toys as the reward and/or use life rewards like going for a walk, sniffing etc.

Another thing you could do is use the chicken you give her a meal times - don't give it to her at meal time or just give a tiny bit with the mash and veg then use the rest throughout the day in training sessions?

Sounds like the medication to me which made her sick, fish4dogs is highly recommended on here I know.

As for the excitedness and lead biting, have you thought about a Gentle Leader or a Halti? They don't particularly like it at first tbh, but it will mean you can give her a nice long walk without being dragged etc. which may help to burn some of that energy off! Also if you praise her all the time shes walking nicely on them, possibly with treats, she will associate being calmer on lead with good things! Also another possibility is joining a local obedience group, the trainer will be able to give you some good tips, plus she can get some socialisation in to boot!

I do hope she feels better soon! Poor Sophie

Wow thanks for all the advice. The vet has done skin scrapes which have all come back negative and she has Advocate every month. We had hoped that once we get her diet right she may calm down and her fur may return.

She does need to burn off more energy and we are working with that. I am taking her out as early as possible (usually around 7am) so there are not too many people around to get her excited, also it is not too warm as she can't walk more than about 20 minutes in the heat without flaking out on the footpath. Also, she does get a shorter walk in the afternoon.

We have a lovely country park not far away but due to a couple of bad experiences with other dog owners and the vet advising us not to walk her in grass (possible pollen allergy) we have avoided it for a while and just road walked her.

I am going to google Gentle Leader in a mo, not soemthing I have heard of.

If we have to take the line of training school or behaviourist we are happy to do so but would like to try and get her back under control ourselves if possible

I think you will find the Gentle Leader or Halti both effective and when she settles into it you will find she will be completely different on the lead!

20 mins walk and a quick one in the afternoon may not be enough, just my opinion. I also live in the UK and yeah the weather has been fairly warm lately. Just avoid the highest temps of the day. Very early morning and late night walks are great, as you say there's less distractions.

She might be a high energy dog that needs more exercise, other ways to wear them out are mind stimulation games like go seek etc.

My Saffy is on raw and I can't praise it enough tbh. Her meaty bone meals seem to keep her mentally stimulated too.

I would advise using either dehydrated or frozen vegetables as treats. They are cheap and low calorie so you can reward as often as needed.

Unless you are positive it's a grass allergy you can always wipe her down with a damp rag after the walk.

It sounds like she might not be getting quite enough exercise. She should have a minimum of two walks per day at 5 minutes duration for month of age.

With the teenage phase it's also best to reinforce basic obediance as often as possible which will help with behaviour and energy levels.

I think perhaps she's not getting enough exercise too; could you start running/cycling/swimming with her if you can't let her off for a ball game or similar?

Another thing to help stimulate and satisfy her is to feed her meals out of a Kong so she has to work at it.

I'm not a fan or head collars much anymore TBH, I think dogs too often find them aversive. If you have a problem with her pulling then I'd recommend a front clipping harness like this - http://www.xtradog.com/shop/harnesses/fleece-dog-harnesses/new-style-xtra-dog-walking-harness-m-size.html rather than a Halti or similar.

Perhaps I phrased that badly. She gets a long walk in the morning around 7am before it gets too hot and a shorter one in the afternoon.

She flakes out after about 20 minutes in the heat, hence why I take her early.

I havn't thought about putting her tea in a kong. Will try that tonight.

Will have a look at the harness in a mo ><

bobs wrote:Perhaps I phrased that badly. She gets a long walk in the morning around 7am before it gets too hot and a shorter one in the afternoon.

She flakes out after about 20 minutes in the heat, hence why I take her early.

I havn't thought about putting her tea in a kong. Will try that tonight.

Will have a look at the harness in a mo ><

I'm sure she'll like that

Ahh OK, I probably read it wrong, thought she was getting about 20 mins in the morning and even less in the afternoon! Even still, for some dogs, walking just isn't enough...

I'm not a fan of the front ring harnesses tbh. They can cause rashes and sores around the arm pits, specially in hot weather and I prefer to have control of the bit that has all the teeth! just my opinion.

Anyhow if you was to get one maybe think about getting a chewing deterrent to put on the lead/s. People on here swear by vicks vapour rub, tho I'd be careful with that one as she's just been poorly. Or I think it was some kind of bitter apple cider?

Good luck

have you thought of using a Thundershirt for the anxiety, a link is below for you to have a look.

Vanessa one of our Moderators is using one for one of her dogs called Jethro and she reports that is has worked very well for him. It may be worth a try !!!

http://www.thundershirt.com/

Afternoon all. I think Sophie must be the stubbornest staffie in the world. We have a thundershirt which by the time we have wrestled her getting it on her hyper bit has gone off the scale.

We tried vic vapour rub. The first time it worked, every other time since then she has taken no notice. The bitter apple spray just incited her and made her worse

I am loathed to put anything that is going to pull tight across her pits as she has no fur on them whatsoever and I don't want to aggravate that or cause another problem.

Please keep the ideas coming - surely between us we can crack this hyper nutter

Having said that, todays walk was quite positive. She didn't go for the lead and carried her red rubber bone quite nicely. I try not to be too far from home in case she goes into one so we sort of walk in a figure of eight route, but with loads of praise and her bone, she had quite an enjoyable time.

hi I just read your posts and was thinking about a thundershirt and I see Kathy beat me to it! Yes they can have an amazing calming effect on a dog..well worth a try.
Also with the treats I saw on the internet someone making their own with sweet potato! Just slice thinly and bake in the oven till they are crisp and hard..I tired to make some..didn't turn out the best but hey my doggies still love it !
All the best!

Wow, thanks for that. Sweet potato on the shopping list

We have just taken a couple fo piccies of her in her thundershirt. Will upload shortly. Having said that, it was much easier to get on than last time

hope the thundershirt helps !!

Morning all. Sophie had another good ealk this morning. No silly antics on her lead

The fish4dogs has arrived so we will be using that as a training treat as she seems to be tolerating that ok so far.

I put her brekkie in her kong this morning. She had a great time Not quite so sure it will happen too often as she gets up on the sofa and throws it to shift the filling. It took me the next twenty minutes getting the bits of mashed spud off of the sofa and carpet

Glad to hear Sophie had a good walk. So long as she keeps her food down that's the main thing, we can all handle a bit of mess if need be.

Sounds like you are doing a great job, she'll come along.

Treats don't have to be dog treats right? Mine would do anything for bits of low fat string cheese . We even slip and call other treats "cheese treat..."

We may all have different views on front ring harnesses. Callie is a dream on one and a pulling nightmare off. Wish I'd tried one sooner.

THis is Sophie in her Thundershirt

Ahhhh bless!

For treats we use mini chedds they blatently ignore you for anything but cheese! The nuggets are tiny so not too calorific for the boy

We are using the fish4dogs as treats.

Sophie has developed a few naughty habits lately so we have a behaviourist coming out to give us some advice on Monday.

She deals with all the difficult dogs that have been taken to the local Dogs Trust so between us we should be able to get madam back on the straight and narrow

Can you not just keep her on the chicken peas and carrots? i feel you are trying so hard to find something that agrees that you are probably making her worse. if she copes with that, keep to it. also try to give her a very calm environment. the more you fuss over her and the more anxious you are about her the more anxious she will be herself. it can be a vicious cycle and one you see very often in chihuahuas who are so wrapped in cotton wool they are neurotic.

Hi Hayley, she will be on the chicken/potato/peas/carrot diet. We struggled to find womething to treat her with during training sessions. Hence why I think she has got into a few naughty habits.

The fish4dogs will be used purely as a training treat certainly for the foresable future as it is a 'valuable' treat that she can tolerate by the looks of things.

With regard to a calm environment there is just me (Shaz) and Bob at home. My son is 24 and is living abroad at the mo so home is a very quiet environment for her. I work part time, mainly from home and Bob does shift work. We can usually work it so that one of us is home with Sophie most of the time.

She is naturally very stressy, hoping she will calm down now she is (hopefully) maturing.

Many thanks to everyone for all their help

Ah right. Thats good. But be aware of how stressed you feel at times. Have you ever tried doggy massages? They are wonderful for stressy dogs

Perhaps we should book her into a spa !!!

Hayley wrote:Can you not just keep her on the chicken peas and carrots? i feel you are trying so hard to find something that agrees that you are probably making her worse. if she copes with that, keep to it. also try to give her a very calm environment. the more you fuss over her and the more anxious you are about her the more anxious she will be herself. it can be a vicious cycle and one you see very often in chihuahuas who are so wrapped in cotton wool they are neurotic.

I agree with what you're saying about being anxious but I can't agree with keeping her on chicken, pots, carrots and peas forever sorry as she won't be getting all the nutrients she needs from that. If she's tolerating the F4Ds then I personally see no reason not to gradually increase the amount she's getting to replace the chicken meals. As I understand it, bobs has only tried to introduce the F4Ds and nothing else apart from the vitamins which didn't appear to agree with her (and sophie wouldn't need them if she is successfully 'weaned' onto a complete food like the F4Ds).

bobs wrote:Perhaps we should book her into a spa !!!

Have you ever looked at TTouch?

Hi Galadriel, as you know we have worked very hard trying to find something that suits her tum.

Because of her being on such a strict regime other thigs have slipped and she has developed some naughty habits that need addressing. Once we have got her health and behaviour balanced we will make the transistion to move her over to f4d providing it works for her. We are just treading very carefully at the mo.

We would rather do the change over several months and have it work than jump in with both feet but right now we have thankfully found something that is a valuable 'treat' we can use as a training tool.

Wonder what this behaviourist will make of her

I have advised her to have a bottle of something strong in the fridge for her return home - she will need it

Never heard of TTouch, will google in a mo ><

bobs wrote:Hi Galadriel, as you know we have worked very hard trying to find something that suits her tum.

Because of her being on such a strict regime other thigs have slipped and she has developed some naughty habits that need addressing. Once we have got her health and behaviour balanced we will make the transistion to move her over to f4d providing it works for her. We are just treading very carefully at the mo.

We would rather do the change over several months and have it work than jump in with both feet but right now we have thankfully found something that is a valuable 'treat' we can use as a training tool.

Wonder what this behaviourist will make of her

I have advised her to have a bottle of something strong in the fridge for her return home - she will need it

Never heard of TTouch, will google in a mo ><

Hope all goes well with the behaviourist!

Fingers cross Sophie will do well with the behaviourist. Now I dont know much about those, but when Pixee was in the blue cross, she became very stressed and started to chew all her bedding to bits, the blue cross became very concerned, cos she also started to get stress out by all the dogs in there. They put some kind of collar on her. Some homorne collar or something. We were advised that it was up to us if we wanted to carry on with the collar or not. They felt it was down to her being in the blue cross. We had a good talk, and had it taken off when we brought her home. Since she has been with us, there has never been a need for it. Just wondered if it would be of any benefit for Sophie or not with her being stressed?

Edited to add, I love those pictures, lovely pink too