2 male dogs 1 staff and cross staff now fighting been fine before tho like thoughts on this please

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:10

As title says, Sorry this mite be along 1 lol Right i moved back with my mum 7 weeks ago with my Staffy also hes just gone 2 had him since pup and has never shown agresion at all as ive soicilised him alot with dogs and people wich has resulted in him being the perfect dog really playful, great with kids and dogs like a little baby really lol well untill i came here, mums dog is Staff cross(dont no what with) anyway they were both fine the first 2-3 weeks of him being here sleeping togethor etc, but after them first few weeks my mums dog has start attacking him its been a daily ocurance that he started growling at him and Alfie my dog would switch and im the only one that can split them up its got to the point that they had been fighting so badly my mums dog has punctured mouth from him locking his jaws and shaking his head when im splitting them up and now limping cant put any pressure on his leg for last 6 days as he has big gashes with flesh showing on his foot and holes in his leg, obviously since that last fight when he done serious damage they have not been aloud togethor since now theres a stair gate to the kitchen where my dog Alfie now stays and has no access to rest of house but yesterday and today my mums dog will go near stair gate and Alfie is there waging his tail wanting to play but my mums dog growls by the gait then all hell breaks loose, (Feels like its not my Alfie no more cuz he changes into a diferent dog) cuz my dog oversly sticks up for him self and they going at it through the gate this has happened about 8 times already today and about 4 times yesterday but the last 5 days previous have been fine being seperated by the gate since his foot has been bad, it seems as if now his foot is getting better hes now trying to challenge him for the damage he done, both dogs are not castrated wich probly dont help but you would of thought they would of started fighting as soon as my dog Alfie enterd my mums house but that werent the case, i would love to know whats now causing this as my dog has cuts and scars on his face now aswell nowhere near as bad as my mums dog and i dont want him to start thinking fighting is ok cuz of my mums dog, i was thinking it was cuz of dominance but surely my mums dog would of been agresive an teritorial since day 1 not 2-3 weeks later as my dog Alfie has not tryed to challenge him or show sighns of agresion in front of him its just my mums dog, but the thing is when my mum or i tell him off in a raised voice he will growl at us, hes done that before when Alfies in the same bed then Alfie switches an start attacking him i just put that down to my dog protecting me seeing his growling at me, Alfie would stick up for me as hes my dog whether thats the case i dont no i just assumed that as Alfies nether been agresive to me, he does as i say when i say as ive trained him that way and had never had a dog fight till i come back here, i take him park all the time since a pup and hes fine with dogs if a dog went for him he would back away, dont know if now hes reaching maturity as hes just turned two i dont know be good for some input into my situation. Thanks

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:17

seems like a dominance thing to me. maybe your dog has challenged your mums dog, he may not have challenged the dog from day one but hes certainly doing it now. he wants to be the alpha male of the pack. i dont think will improve in the near future if anything it could get worse m8

by shep Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:22

Is there any way you can find out what your mums dog is crossed with? maybe that would help the professionals here. Mine is crossed with a collie. Anything like this?
https://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/staffordshire-bull-terrier-galleries-f8/freddy-10-weeks-to-10-months-t1549.htm

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:27

but i supervise them all the time and the only one who shows agresive and dominant an growls is my mums dog so surely thats not the case, but i did think that now he's growing up and not being a pup no more he would start being more dominant but i havnt seen any sighns from Alfie yet tho

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:31

I will try get a pic now an upload now, where would i upload so you can see tho,he looks like he's crossed with Jack Russel to me

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:34

your mums dog is showing him who the boss is, he will eventually take up the challenge

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:35

Sounds like a dominance thing to me to. It can take weeks for a dog to settle into their new environment/pack.
To me it sounds like the dogs have settled into thier new pack and are looking to find their pecking order. Like Shane said these things don't normally improve.
If it was me I would look to ensuring I first gained the status of pack leader then start to re introduce them to each other again. First on seperate leads and at a distance maybe at each end of the garden, using this time to reward the dogs for non aggressive behaviour towards each other with treats and over time start to shorten the distance till they get to the point of been off leash together.

by shep Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:39

Create an account on http://photobucket.com/ where you can upload and save all your pics for free

by **niff** Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:45

id have to agree with the dominance train of thought , and you mentioned neither dog is nutered , im not sure how how big a factor that would be , as i know there would be no assurance that nutering would stop the fighting

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:48

BlueStaffBlue wrote:Sounds like a dominance thing to me to. It can take weeks for a dog to settle into their new environment/pack.
To me it sounds like the dogs have settled into thier new pack and are looking to find their pecking order. Like Shane said these things don't normally improve.
If it was me I would look to ensuring I first gained the status of pack leader then start to re introduce them to each other again. First on seperate leads and at a distance maybe at each end of the garden, using this time to reward the dogs for non aggressive behaviour towards each other with treats and over time start to shorten the distance till they get to the point of been off leash together.

Alfie already no's im the Alpha male i know that for certain, its just my mums dog (he was a rescue tho wich dont help), he must growl at me when i tell him off cuz he dont trust me an feel safe with me infront of him aswell as my mum, where with Alfie i can do what i want and hes fine cuz he knows im boss and he only listens to me but not my girlfriend where my mums dog dont listen to anyone not even her wich is his owner

by **niff** Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:51

are the two dogs getting plenty walks and burning off alot of energy

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:51

shep wrote:Create an account on http://photobucket.com/ where you can upload and save all your pics for free

will do that now, just charging my phone to take pictures, everbody has said he's a staff cross if not he's a runt of the litter i dont know tho really would be good for more opinions on what he is. Im guessing its ok to post outside links to photobucket then?

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:57

niff wrote:are the two dogs getting plenty walks and burning off alot of energy

My dog Alfie does everyday but my mums dog dont go anywhere except back garden, i do tell her but she dont do nothing about it, i was taking both of them at 1 time quite a few time on a double lead but Bruzer mums dog just pulls to much and i let him off the lead 1 time and he started on another dog so havnt taking him since he started fighting with another dog

by shep Mon Dec 06 2010, 16:59

Im not entirely sure what you mean with external links. Is it ok to post photobucket links here, do you mean?

confused

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 17:12

shep wrote:Im not entirely sure what you mean with external links. Is it ok to post photobucket links here, do you mean?

yes

by shep Mon Dec 06 2010, 17:27

Yeah most people here encourage people to use photobucket because its easy to use, virus, malware and spyware free and you get to save all your favourite pics on your account. If you want any help uploading feel free to add me on facebook or gmail

https://www.facebook.com/shepp7
sheppp7@gmail.com

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 17:31

It sounds to me like there are 2 separate packs living together. You and your dog and your mum and her dog. 2 Packs will always fight.
I think this is never a straight forward issue to solve and I can't see it being possible unless you all work together as one pack.
You say your living back with your mum, is this going to be a long term arrangement?

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 17:38

shep wrote:Yeah most people here encourage people to use photobucket because its easy to use, virus, malware and spyware free and you get to save all your favourite pics on your account. If you want any help uploading feel free to add me on facebook or gmail

https://www.facebook.com/shepp7
sheppp7@gmail.com

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 17:38

shep wrote:Yeah most people here encourage people to use photobucket because its easy to use, virus, malware and spyware free and you get to save all your favourite pics on your account. If you want any help uploading feel free to add me on facebook or gmail

https://www.facebook.com/shepp7
sheppp7@gmail.com

Na thanks tho mate, pictures now uploaded heres link ok mate. https://s954.photobucket.com/albums/ae25/chod360/Mum%20dog%20Bruzer/

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 18:19

BlueStaffBlue wrote:It sounds to me like there are 2 separate packs living together. You and your dog and your mum and her dog. 2 Packs will always fight.
I think this is never a straight forward issue to solve and I can't see it being possible unless you all work together as one pack.
You say your living back with your mum, is this going to be a long term arrangement?

Its only temp until i find somewhere to live permonant to live. Just dont want them fighting any more cuz he will end up killing my mums dog luckily im here all the time to split them up when they do fight if not my mums dog would be dead as i know staff's fight till there death and the damage Alfie has done to him already and Alfie come out with minor cuts on him, and his twice as muscle an solid as him thats why i think he would kill him seeing Bruzer has had punctuer wounds from Alfie's teeth all over him and now he cant walk for the past week or put pressure on his leg but Bruzer still growls at Alfie at the gate, you would think he would know already as he cant walk on 1 leg but he still growls at the gate then they both are going for eachother frew the gate, luckily the gates there and they cant bite eacthother really

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 18:30

Since your planning on moving soon I would just keep them seperated at the moment.

by chod Mon Dec 06 2010, 18:36

What do you think he's crossed with then?

https://s954.photobucket.com/albums/ae25/chod360/Mum%20dog%20Bruzer/

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 22:09

BlueStaffBlue wrote:Sounds like a dominance thing to me to. It can take weeks for a dog to settle into their new environment/pack.
To me it sounds like the dogs have settled into thier new pack and are looking to find their pecking order. Like Shane said these things don't normally improve.
If it was me I would look to ensuring I first gained the status of pack leader then start to re introduce them to each other again. First on seperate leads and at a distance maybe at each end of the garden, using this time to reward the dogs for non aggressive behaviour towards each other with treats and over time start to shorten the distance till they get to the point of been off leash together.

I'm sorry to be a kiljoy here, but I don't think it will work. Your mum's dog is untrained & unsocialised & it would take a helluva lot of work & time to change his ways, even if you could, which is unlikely.

You must seperate the dogs completely. Now they have issued & accepted the challenge & fought, they will continue to do so until one is beaten. That will certainly result in serious injury & possibly death.

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 22:15

I have posted since then giving the advice of just make sure you keep them seperated.
Im a great believer that most behaviours can be solved with time and hard work. But this is a case where that is not going to be possible on his own. Plus he is planning on moving out in the near future.

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 22:20

Yes, I know. I agree that with time it MAY be possible to modify the behaviour, but only if mum is willing to do her bit as well & it doesn't sound like she is.

Staffords are a funny breed. Some, once they get a taste for fighting, will do it at every opportunity & will develop a particular dislike for certain dogs. If that has happened here, there may be no going back. I'm a little concerned that your own dog will learn that fighting is fun (yes, they DO enjoy it) and all your hard work in socialising will be down the drain.

Hopefully, as you're moving out sooner rather than later, you can keep them apart & all will be well.

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 22:21

The U turn was cos I felt he was working on this one on his own Laughing

by Guest Mon Dec 06 2010, 22:30

Yes, think you're right there.

Chod, the link you posted doesn't work. It'll be interesting to see what your mum's dog looks like, though I don't think it'll make any difference to your situation.

by shep Tue Dec 07 2010, 08:38

The link works for me Caryll

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 09:56

Caryll wrote:
BlueStaffBlue wrote:Sounds like a dominance thing to me to. It can take weeks for a dog to settle into their new environment/pack.
To me it sounds like the dogs have settled into thier new pack and are looking to find their pecking order. Like Shane said these things don't normally improve.
If it was me I would look to ensuring I first gained the status of pack leader then start to re introduce them to each other again. First on seperate leads and at a distance maybe at each end of the garden, using this time to reward the dogs for non aggressive behaviour towards each other with treats and over time start to shorten the distance till they get to the point of been off leash together.

I'm sorry to be a kiljoy here, but I don't think it will work. Your mum's dog is untrained & unsocialised & it would take a helluva lot of work & time to change his ways, even if you could, which is unlikely.

You must seperate the dogs completely. Now they have issued & accepted the challenge & fought, they will continue to do so until one is beaten. That will certainly result in serious injury & possibly death.

Completeley agree! And since its only a short term arrangement i would defo keep them seperate at all times barr when u are with them so u can correct either dogs behaviour. Its not the end of the world some dogs just dont get on espeacially staffs who are not the worlds greatest dog dogs! x

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 10:19

As an aside, I just managed to get the link to work (!) and he looks very much like a boxer cross to me. He's pretty big, isn't he? The head somehow says boxer, too.

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 10:22

Yea could be.....i would say defo not jrt though x

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 10:30

No, not jrt.

by chod Tue Dec 07 2010, 11:09

Just been reading about Boxers and i think he could be as the name was arrived by them standing on there hind legs and boxing with his paws which he does that all the time, hes not really big tho maybe 2 inchs bigger than Alfie and Alfies a small legged Staf, Alfies about 20 KG now and hes alot heavier then him so i would say about 15 or 16 KG my mums dog is, so i dont kno really, They tried to go for eachother 3 times already this morning

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 11:15

The pics look like he's certainly taller than an average staff, although it could be deceptive. It's just the shape of his head that seems to say 'boxer' to me. You can't tell from him using his paws like that, they all do it!! Big Grin

I really don't think you will be able to stop them fighting without a very long drawn out, properly devised behaviour re-modification programme, and that doesn't seem feasiblr (and even that may not work). Your best bet is to keep them permanently seperated till you can find your own place.

by chod Tue Dec 07 2010, 11:27

Yeah thats what im going to have to do cuz as soon as they even see eachother now he growls and they start attacking frew the gate, i just dont see what has brung it on as the gate was there for 5 days previous and they both were licking eachother frew the gate everyday but now my mums dog cant even make eye contact or go near gate now as he just growls at Alfie and then he switches an both trying to bite eachother frew the gate, an im woried that Alfie will think its ok to fight, seeing i have him off the lead where ever i go now if we see a dog i would no for certain he wouldnt start attacking that dog but now i dont no if thats still the case anymore, thats why i want to keep them apart cuz i dont want Alfie to start being agresive like some said before i hope its not to late for Alfie as all the work i done soicilising him and making him not agresive

by Guest Tue Dec 07 2010, 11:30

I think the problem was that for the first few days Alfie was settling in & would have been a little submissive to your mum's dog. But as he became more confident, your mum's dog would have sensed this & may not have liked it.

by Dieselsmummy Wed Dec 08 2010, 22:15

Chod , as a separate issue has your mums dog seen a vet? 6 days not being able to walk or put pressure on his leg would make me concerned.

He may have an infection in one of the cuts.

I would def not leave them alone together for one second if it were me. Fingers crossed you find somewhere more permanent to live soon.
Hope things improve

by jaykay Tue Jan 04 2011, 22:42

another seperate issue, you should realy try and get your mum to exercise this dog just letting him the garden is doing him no good at all,i also think i see some boxer in him especialy in the pic where he has his paw in someones hand if he does have boxer in him he will need alot of exercise as i find boxers to be a bit flighty. not exercising them does them no good mentaly and it could help calm him down. good luck.

by Guest Fri Jan 14 2011, 19:38

Your Mums dog does not look like a Stafford cross to me, i'ld say his a true Stafford, just not a bred to standard one.

by **gem** Fri Jan 14 2011, 20:44

poor dog !!!! he probably has an infection in his leg due to him being bitten if you have no means to take him to the vet then hibiscrub is good its a cheap antibacterial wash you can buy from the chemist, any bite from a mouth has loads of germs he will be in agony no wonder he is grumpy.
You should keep them apart until you move I dont think it will get any better and its not fair. I hope your boy will be good with other dogs as he was when your situation changes good luck hope everything wrks out for you Smile

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