Leavitt bulldog

First topic message reminder :

do you think this type of bulldog should replace the kc register bull dog?

i think if someone spend time and searching hard they could find a bulldog type that matches a british bulldog but with a longer muzzle.

I wish......but I doubt that there would be enough to make a difference.

the dalmatians backcross project shows it can be done and proof some club dont want to make healthy lines

bigwazza wrote:there must still be some nice examples that can be breed from there just needs to be a proper breeding program and stop the breeding from the deformed specimens that were used to create the example shown

these two are far better examples

i think these would struggle to breath also imo the muzzle needs to be longer

Steve wrote:

bigwazza wrote:there must still be some nice examples that can be breed from there just needs to be a proper breeding program and stop the breeding from the deformed specimens that were used to create the example shown

these two are far better examples

i think these would struggle to breath also imo the muzzle needs to be longer

Yes, but they are a step in the right direction!

I would outcross the brit bulldog with staffordshire bull terriers to make the breed more healthy-they are after all-are the ancestors of the original bulldogs.

No, they're not! Bulldogs are the ancestors of the stafford!!

:S That's exactly what I meant-I think you read it the wrong way round. By 'are' I meant staffies, not bulldogs.

i wouild like to see a muzzle like this on a british bulldog

I don't mean to offend you both but seriously just google the 'victorian bulldog.' It's exactly the sort of dog you're both talking about.

http://www.bulldoginformation.com/victorian-bulldog.html

http://www.greatdogsite.com/photos/list/Victorian_Bulldog/

we talking about helping the british bulldog, it cant carry on how it is they cant even give birth naturally, there 2 options IMO we let it breed die out or do what some dalmatians breeders did cross bred it with a another breed.

Yes but you're both talking about breeding in another dog or adjusting the standard to help it, surely the victorian bulldog would be the best option? Personally i'd change the standard so it looks much more like the victorian. The victorian is unmistakably a very bulldoggy looking bulldog and has lost none of its distinctive features such as the cobby, muscular build, the underbit jaw-BUT it does not suffer the health problems of the british bulldog.

i would like to see abit longer muzzle than the v bulldog

I think we are disagreeing about semantics and the context of the words rather than the idea of using out crosses etc? i think it would help if they do more controlled out crosses with lists of approved crosses etc and after a period stop registering new offspring as the "pure" ones are integrated into the breed in question.They do that to increase the gene pool in my cats , could we not do that in dogs?. That's all i was saying really.

We all know what needs to happen but the KC brit bulldog breeders are dragging their heels. If I recall when slight changes were made to the standard they argued that the dogs wouldn't look like British Bulldogs anymore.
Personally I love bulldogs, but if I was in the market for one I wouldn't buy a brit, I would buy an american, a victorian or a Dorset old tyme bulldog. Theres also a similar one called the Alphaha (sp) blue blood bulldog. As the KC have refused to acknowledge the extreme unhealthyness of the modern brit bulldog, so many other responsible breeders have taken matters into their own hands and bred examples like the ones listed above. If people love bulldogs and want a healthier one, they should ignore the brit bulldog entirely and get one of those.

They do that to increase the gene pool in my cats ,

What cats do you have?

They do that to increase the gene pool in my cats ,

What cats do you have?

The pedigree ones are Laperms , they appeared 30 years ago in the USA and are all descended from one cat, very healthy breed because they used lots of out crosses etc as they increased numbers.

dog breeders as got it all wrong the main problem i would say is close line breding. if i was a breeder the dog i would be breding they wouldn't be ralated.

well i have learnt more about the kennel club and breeders watching the programme and reading on here and to be honest i just find it snobby. yes i agree that we should protect dog breeds but not to the extent these are going to and not at the extent of exluding a perfectly healthy dog like the dalmation mentioned its just pure snobbery

shakespearesdog wrote:I don't mean to offend you both but seriously just google the 'victorian bulldog.' It's exactly the sort of dog you're both talking about.

They are nearer the mark. However, when I googled them, I noticed some that were way too heavy & looked more like American Bullies! I certainly wouldn't want to see that extreme used! But the less extreme ones are quite nice looking & very near the bulldog of today but without the exagerrations.

shakespearesdog wrote:Yes but you're both talking about breeding in another dog or adjusting the standard to help it, surely the victorian bulldog would be the best option? Personally i'd change the standard so it looks much more like the victorian. The victorian is unmistakably a very bulldoggy looking bulldog and has lost none of its distinctive features such as the cobby, muscular build, the underbit jaw-BUT it does not suffer the health problems of the british bulldog.

The KC have changed the breed standard & the wording is much better now that they have introduced a minimum distance between the eyes & the nose. In time that will lengthen the muzzle & decrease the breething difficulties. If they were to use one or two of the lighter, less exagerratedly huge Victorian Bulldogs in a breeding programme it would speed matters up a bit.

However, when I googled them, I noticed some that were way too heavy & looked more like American Bullies! I certainly wouldn't want to see that extreme used! But the less extreme ones are quite nice looking & very near the bulldog of today but without the exagerrations.

Yeah, there's no way they should be so heavy! Some indiscriminate breeders spoiling it again. I've met victorian bulldogs several times and the dogs have looked great, stocky but not fat, very bulldoggy faces but no trouble breathing-as it should be. I've also met british bulldogs several times and was shocked by how awkwardly they moved and were wheezing and struggling to breathe. I felt really sorry for the poor dogs.
I've met much healthier pugs! Actually the pug is a breed I've noticed has looked a lot healthier recently. There's a man I see sometimes that goes cycling and jogging with his-they race around and there's no snorting at all. They're still instantly recognisable as pugs though.
Of course with all this British bulldog bashing I'm at the risk of sounding massively hypocritical, I love pugs and French bulldogs and my own staff is very cobby and bully type.

Ben, Gimli was a gorgeous dog. I'd definitely consider one of those. Stunning

I think that they are verry different and should not be compare, they have the same root but evoluate from different usage. I think that the show dog should evoluate to come more natural. It is only reasonnable to correct some probleme that make the breed survive. In fact, from what is the dog write now, the breed would not survive in a natural envirement without the intervention of the human. He cant have litter without surgery, in a natural environnement the female and the pup will die. He cant bite normaly and cant hunt his meal, that give us the signe that the human have pass the limite of acceptable modification but he shouldkeep is différences from other bulldog breed.

I am a Leavitt Bulldog owner and i appreciate every bulldog breed for what they are, the are there for different usage and have to follow there own evolution. But it could be consider to use other bulldog to correct some default like what the Dr John D.Johnson said ''There is no probleme to breed bulldog with bulldog''. At the origin, they come from the same dog.

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