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Post by Lee5159 on Mon May 06 2019, 17:28

I went to see some staff puppies with their mum yesterday. They give me kc copy for dad which they don’t own twhey only have mum who is not kc. I’m just a bit unsure weather they are purebreds or not.

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Post by Nifty staffy on Mon May 06 2019, 17:55

Genetically speaking, it is possible that they are “pure bred” staffies but if mum doesn’t have KC papers, there’s no proof.
Therefore officially, they are not pure bred staffies but that should make no difference to having a great family friend. It will be a problem if you intend to breed or show

Just on a side note, you must be aware that it’s not at all recommended to breed blue to blue and it greatly increases the possibility of having health problems.


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Post by LizP on Mon May 06 2019, 18:56

I'd echo the warning about the blue breeding. Looking at the dad's paper, there is blue on blue going on there already and if you then add a blue mum you're really into 'deep blue' territory.

Do have a look a the skin issues suffered by some blue staffies. And if you search here for hair loss and associated problems, they are nearly all blues. I volunteer in rescue and many of the blue dogs we get in have hair loss and itch like whatevery you itch like. It's sad for them and it's also upsetting for you the owner. Other colours are great dogs too, honest!



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Post by Lee5159 on Mon May 06 2019, 22:37

Nifty staffy wrote:Genetically speaking, it is possible that they are “pure bred” staffies but if mum doesn’t have KC papers, there’s no proof.
Therefore officially, they are not pure bred staffies but that should make no difference to having a great family friend. It will be a problem if you intend to breed or show

Just on a side note, you must be aware that it’s not at all recommended to breed blue to blue and it greatly increases the possibility of having health problems.

Why are they prone to health issues? Sorry I’ve just never heard this before, don’t all dogs have chance on getting health issues?

I have owed staffy’s before but never a blue or blue & white. My profile pic is my bitch staff I had for 14yrs 4months & 21 days, beautiful she was, unfortunately she is no longer with us she passed away few month ago, I regret not having a litter with her.
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Post by Nifty staffy on Tue May 07 2019, 05:33

Your staffy in your avatar is absolutely gorgeous, so sorry for your loss.

Yes, all dogs can have health issues but due to genetics and certain breeding practices, some will be more prone than others.
Breed 2 dogs together who both have hip problems, you are more likely to reproduce that problem in the puppies.

Blue is a dilution of the black gene so is prone to colour dilution alopecia. You can already have a look on this link
http://staffy-bull-terrier.niceboard.com/t17716-colour-dilution-alopecia?highlight=Alopecia

Unfortunately the blue colour has become fashion so alot of breeding has been done purely to get the colour, regardless of a better match between parents. In order to try to get more blue pups (Which are often sold more expensive too), many are breeding blue to blue but this increases the risk of CDA, amongst other things.

You are less likely to have problems with a blue puppy born from 2 parents who are blue carriers but not blue themselves. Or a very dark blue born from one blue parent. The most at risk would be the very light blue born from blue parents.

Much as I can understand that the colouring is nice and atypical (I have a b&t purebred staffy myself), the heartache dealing with the health issues just aren’t worth it, IMHO. Then it’s your choice.
Just ensure that the parents and hence puppies are clear for HC and l2hga, that’s the strict minimum for any staffy.


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Post by gillybrent on Tue May 07 2019, 20:06

Do you know why the mum isn't KC registered & why (in that case) they wanted to breed from her? 

Has she been tested for the hereditary health problems, as stated by Nifty? Has the dad been tested?

These DNA tests are vital for the future health of all Staffords.

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Post by Lee5159 on Tue May 07 2019, 20:51

gillybrent wrote:Do you know why the mum isn't KC registered & why (in that case) they wanted to breed from her? 

Has she been tested for the hereditary health problems, as stated by Nifty? Has the dad been tested?

These DNA tests are vital for the future health of all Staffords.

I know the sire has had the HC-HSF4 & L-2HGA test & is hereditary clear. I don’t think mum has had these tests.
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Post by Nifty staffy on Tue May 07 2019, 21:02

To be brutally honest, you’re looking at investing love and affection towards your puppy for the next 15 years.
The puppy you post about has, unfortunately, alot of things going against it.

Mum not to date with paperwork so breeding and testing unsure/unknown. Curious breeding pairing which puts a blue on a blue. Up to now, these are all reasons NOT to breed.

I don’t know whether it's just an optical effect in the photo but the pup has something with it’s eyes.
However sweet the pup is, I would walk away ... there are plenty more puppies out there with better starts in life to adopt.


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Post by LizP on Wed May 08 2019, 08:06

To be honest, I'd rather have a pup from completely non-papered parent than one that has been badly bred. It is breeding for appearance rather than health that has led to the terrible problems with various breeds, including pugs, King Charles spaniels and German shepherds. Many breeders are great, but sadly many aren't and you, the buyer, have to work on the assumption that you've hit one that isn't and be careful.

I would walk away from this pup, I'm afraid, even though you've obviously fallen for it.



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Post by gillybrent on Wed May 08 2019, 12:18

Lee5159 wrote:
gillybrent wrote:Do you know why the mum isn't KC registered & why (in that case) they wanted to breed from her? 

Has she been tested for the hereditary health problems, as stated by Nifty? Has the dad been tested?

These DNA tests are vital for the future health of all Staffords.

I know the sire has had the HC-HSF4 & L-2HGA test & is hereditary clear. I don’t think mum has had these tests.

Walk away, is my advice, especially if they're asking full price as the pups are not pedigree staffordshire bull terriers. I've known someone whose dog developed L2HGA, and it was torture watching the deterioration over the weeks/months. The dog eventually had to be pts. Sad

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