Is this normal at 18 months?????

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Help. Star has just started taking an interest in her own poos and trying to eat them! YUK! Obviously we have stopped her but yuk yuk yuk. If she was a tiny pup I wouldnt be so surprised but she is 18 months old now.

Any ideas why?

let us know how it goes it may take a couple of days to kick in she may well wake you for the fun of it as that has been her routine, but she will get into the new routine. how is her behaviour been latley?

Much much better. She now knows to leave Tia alone and Tia isnt quite so freaked out now - we've even seen them licking each others faces!! She still tries it on with Rocky's collar but they play really well together. Rocky was a total couch potato but now he loves a game of chase - runs around with the frisbee with her chasing!
We still wouldnt leave them alone together though - she forgets herself sometimes when really excited and grabs for a collar.
Def doesnt like being crated when we go out but at least it keeps them all safe.
Getting there.slowly. It's only just a week and a half and if we can sort the sleep problem out everything else will be easy. Surprising how little things seem like mountains when you are knackered. haha.

she will get use to being created if she has not been used to it, just keep it a happy place for her lots of toys food and drink, she will get use to it. i am glad that things are getting better let me know how the new feeding ragiem goes.

I hope she does get used to it.
Well, we gave them all a snack at 5pm yesterday, long walk at 7pm followed by their dinner.
Took em all out for business at about 10.30pm. Star settled down fairly quickly but guess what..........she started barking at 4am again. We left her for half an hour but she didnt stop or quieten down. Took her out - she did one of both!!! Went back in her cage and slept till......6am! Arghh. Back outside - did nothing - back to her cage and slept till....7am. After this we gave up trying to sleep. Sooooooooo tired now, total zombies.
Am wondering if she is getting enough exercise to tire her out. She gets three long walks per day and is out in the garden playing for probably half the day all in all.
I've just ordered a treadmill!!! Gonna do exercise the Millan way haha. Its worth a try to try and get some sleep as we cant go on like this!!

lisalisa- can I ask how old she is?

The RSPCA reckon 18 months although she could be a little younger. She apparently had puppies - which is why she went to the rescue. They kept the pups and dumped her! She was then rehomed by RSPCA but they returned her because they said she was destructive.
She is definitely young and was very thin when we got her.
They said she was a "small staffie" but she does look awfully young, especially to have had pups!

Aaa, she's absolutely gorgeous! Poor little girl to have pups that young, that's just awful! That is rather old to still be wanting to go out in the middle of the night, poor you! I was thinking that maybe it's just become a habit for her now to get up at that time, and now she's in that habit, she expects you to get up and let her out at that time. Could you try leaving it a little later each time that you let her out, then eventually, hopefully she'll go out at a sensible time! With the dogs we've had, (not including small puppies obviously, as they need to "go" more!) if they whined or barked, we just ignored them, we never went downstairs, and after a few nights they knew that it wasn't going to get a reaction, so they slept 'til we got up. Good luck with her.

We have tried ignoring her but she just carries on. What concerns me is that when she does get out she goes to the toilet,as if it is a habitual time for her to go!
Tonight we're aiming for 8pm to sleep!!! We're going to keep the other two dogs in with us and crate her next door as usual.
That way we can just completely ignore her however long she carries on. As you say, she is a bit old for still wanting out at that time.
If we can get one good nights sleep it will make it a bit easier for the next few nights! haha. Unfortunately we live in a small cottage, one large bedroom, one large living room, kitchen, bathroom and a narrow hallway! There are attic bedrooms but dont fancy sharing them with any mice!!!

I'm glad you say you have a crate for her! I was going to suggest crating her at night, but I know some people are against using crates for dogs. If they are used properly, I do not see a problem with using them. If she was mine, I think I'd just ignore her, even if she went on and on all night! I know it sounds cruel, but if you go to her when she whines or bark, she sees that she has won, and she can get you to do what she wants! I know it's really hard, and they're so good at making you feel sorry for them! I remember sitting upstairs crying my eyes out when Fen was younger, and used to howl and yap at night to get us to go down! I stood my ground, and put up with the noise, and honestly, in the end, they do give up! Let me know how you get on! Buy some ear plugs! xx

Now thats a good idea!haha. Yeah its awful when we leave her. I can handle the barking but she makes these mewling noises that sound like a cross between a baby and a cat! So pitiful. We have tried leaving her to bark but after half an hour we've given in, mainly because of the other two dogs trying to sleep in there! Tia gets so freaked out by her and runs out the room. Thats why we thought we'd try them both in our room tonight, that way we might all sleep!
Appreciate your messages - we were beginning to wonder what we'd done getting a third dog. The other two settled in so well, absolutely no probs at all but this little munchkin........!
I've always hated the idea of crating a dog but I can really see the advantages - means we can leave all three dogs home and know they are safe - as well as giving her somewhere secure and safe to sleep......well that is when she does sleep!

I always had 2 crates when I had 2 dogs, as I was never happy leaving them together when we went out incase of a fight. Now we just have Fen, and I don't have a crate as she's fine left on her own now she's older. If I ever had a dog with seperation anxiety that chewed everything, I'd have no probs with using a crate again. At least you know they and your home are safe! Yeah, it's probably better to take the other dogs out, poor things need some sleep too ha ha! Just try for a few nights to totally ignore her 'til the morning. You know she is safe, and can come to no harm in the crate. Dogs are less likely to poo near where they sleep, so that's another good reason for having her in the crate. I know what you mean about the little noises they make! They certainly know how to pull your heart strings! You keep at it! Don't give in! Best of luck with her. xx

*Amber* wrote:I'm glad you say you have a crate for her! I was going to suggest crating her at night, but I know some people are against using crates for dogs. If they are used properly, I do not see a problem with using them. If she was mine, I think I'd just ignore her, even if she went on and on all night! I know it sounds cruel, but if you go to her when she whines or bark, she sees that she has won, and she can get you to do what she wants! I know it's really hard, and they're so good at making you feel sorry for them! I remember sitting upstairs crying my eyes out when Fen was younger, and used to howl and yap at night to get us to go down! I stood my ground, and put up with the noise, and honestly, in the end, they do give up! Let me know how you get on! Buy some ear plugs! xx

QFT!

*Caution: Long post ahead*

I made this mistake with my first pup. Went in and gave her a stern ticking off, immediately followed by some comforting cubbles the first couple of nights. Before you knew it she wouldn't let us shut the kitchen door. Took a lot of effort to break it once the behaviour was ingrained but you really have to and the sooner you do the sooner they stop.

The Cesar way of "rehabilitation" where he left the dog for short periods of time and rewarded it when it STFU, gradually increasing the time he left it. Made sense to me.

With Sylar being the first puppy my GF has owned I tried to explain to her exactly how "heart-wrenching" and "LOUD!" this process was going to be, on the first night and I guess she thought I was exaggerating or something.

The second night we had a total doozy of a time and, after about 20 mins of the usual little whining sessions he started going totally ape. Like instead of the usual pitiful whimper this was bordering on blind/panic/rage and a truckload of stomping about.

I waited about 5 mins then thought "no way" that's not a natural instinct-driven seperation anxiety kinda noise for a dog to make, I put up with months of that. I know how it sounds. So I went down. I need a bit of backstory now - bear with me.

We have a gap between our washing machine, where it meets the sink-unit at a right angle. He was so tiny at this stage that he could still make it in there and if he started chewing on cables and stuff back there there would be a whole lot of bad that I didn't want to even think about so I got a bit of plywood that wedged in and curved round the washing machine.

So anyway he's managed to force his way under a small gap near the kickplate of the sink unit which I hadn't noticed and then got stuck in the semicircle plywood "fence" which he could just see over if he stood up with his paws on top of it and ROARED AT THE TOP OF HIS TINY LUNGS!!!

I took him out and put him back to bed while I figured out what had happened and how to fix it. I ended up working in the plywood to a different part of the sink-unit, where there was no gap and went back to bed. To be honest I don't think I needed to bother. He's never once showed the slightest bit of interest in that corner, except when the washing machine is on, which he seems to enjoy more than the telly and I figure he learned a hard lesson that night - do not mess about in the kitchen at night.

Wasn't the third night but the fourth or fifth that he stopped crying at night but it quieted down a lot and didn't go on as long after the "indessit incident".

Haha - thank you! I can just picture the scene. We made a huge mistake the first two nights we had her. She had been grabbing the collars of our other two dogs and getting them really upset so we decided it wasnt safe to leave them all together. We didnt have a crate at this point (being naive thinking she would settle as our other two had!!!). We took her into our bedroom where she promptly jumped up on the bed all night long. BAD move.
Am SO looking forward to an early night..at least we might get in 6-7 hours before she starts! She;s not too bad when we first leave her and settles within 10 mins but then she wakes at 4am regular as clockwork and I guess we have reinforced the fact if she barks she gets attention! And there was us thinking we were pretty good at this doggy thing (AND we watch all Dog Whisperer episodes and really should know better)!!!!
Fingers crossed.....................and ears plugged.

Hey, don't blame youself! Everyone gets in a pickle at some stage! My friend and I are in love with Cesar! Have you read any of his books? I have read Cesar's way, and thought it was brilliant! I really enjoyed reading it! Good luck for tonight (and other nights!) It's really hard to start with, but you can't go on like this! xx

I'm just about finished Cesar's "Member of the family"

One thing that struck me was the whole chapter on "overvaccination"

Apparently the FDA or whoever governs this kind of thing in the US are now recommending that dogs receive vaccination boosters every 3 years instead of every year.

Anyone else heard of this?

I hadn't heard this, but I've heard they can be over vaccinated. A lot of dogs have health problems or reactions after their boosters, but what do you do? We all want the best for our dogs, but what IS the best?!

According to Cesar there's a way of testing for antibodies or something. I'm going to look into this because I'm a firm believer in a healthy immune system and that requires the odd workout but with overvaccination and too much antibiotics you actually end up with a weaker immune system.

The thing that bothers me a bit with Cesar is he's into the whole "homeopathy" trip. I have a great deal of respect for him as a behavioural psychologist but as soon as I hear "acupuncture" my BS detector gets all skeptical about his grasp of medicine.

BTW maybe a mod could split this topic - this is interesting but we're kind of derailing the fread now (me at my best)

Acupuncture really is fantastic, and can help some really ill doggies! I'm a believer in acupuncture.

Yeah, isn't that test they do to check for antibodies called a titre test? I may have spelt that wrong! I think my dog trainer mentioned it before, but it's more expensive than the vaccination, so if your dog isn't immune, you'd then have to pay for the vaccination as well! What if your dog is immune to one disease, but not another? Do the vets do vaccinations for each disease singly, or are they all combination vaccinations? Just a lot of things to think about!!!

"titre" rings a bell. I don't mind paying a bit extra if it's better for Sylar. If the first couple of years he still needs the vaccination I'd be more inclined to stick to annual after that.

Mmm, it's all so confusing lol!

lisalisa- Well how did last night go????? (Or shouldn't I ask!)

Found this, it explains it quite well!

http://www.fetchdog.com/learn-connect/dog-resource-library/health/diagnostic-tests/Antibody-Titres/D/300600/P/1:5:55:601:6103/I/AR000010418

Morning Amber.

And it is a GOOD morning.at last! We couldnt sleep last night as it was so early but dropped off around half ten. Half woke up a couple of times but that was more to do with the other two dogs being in with us.
Got up at 8am expecting tons of poo and wee and a very messy dog. She was CLEAN!! Let her out and she bombed round the house like a rocket.
Such a relief to get a good nights sleep - changes your whole outlook haha. She kept up her yelling for a while last night but we havew got a noisy plug in air conditioner unit so put that next to our bed and shut all the doors.
Thank you everyone for your comments, stories and advice...I now feel human (ish) again!

We have read Cesar's Way Amber - excellent book. Also read his website for tips and ideas. Tia does the whole bike run thing without a lead although Rocky has yet to master it. Will start Star training for it soon. Had thought about a skateboard but dont really want to end up with broken limbs! haha.

Wow, I'm sooooo pleased for you! Well done for not going to her! You must be so pleased! Keep up the good work, and don't ever give in, or you'll be back to square 1 again! xx

Broken limbs lol! Cesar is so energetic isn't he?!

Yeah I know. I get out of breath going up a hill on the bike!
Poor Tia has to wait while I walk up it.
We went to bed last night with the attitude she can make us much noise as she likes but we aint getting up! Think in a way it helped being so tired cos we were determined to get a good sleep whatever happened. Will have our other two in with us again tonight so we can shut the doors but then they are going back in the same room as her. They like to have a shake and scratch through the night and snore too loudly for my liking!

I get out of breath riding my bike too! Well done to both of you for doing what you set out to do! Snoring, tell me about it! I can hear Fen snoring downstairs, when I'm lying in bed upstairs! Think it's their short noses that makes them snore!

Haha. When Star sniffs the ground she sounds like a pig! We were a bit concerned when we first got her - snoring is like a train. Must try to get her on video - she does this "commando" thing down the grass slope. Think her belly itches so she tries to relieve it. Trouble is she gets a bit carried away and ends up rolling down the hill. Hilarious.

Ha ha, yeah you definitely need to video that! Fen sounds like a pig when she sniffs as well, it's perfectly normal for the breed!

Might use it as my ringtone!

Ha ha ha ha, that's a brilliant idea!

Another reasonable nights sleep!! I didnt hear her until 7.30 this morning! Thanks for your advice! Other two dogs are going back in the room with her tonight if its not too hot - had enough of being kicked and loud snoring. Just hope Rocky doesnt start clawing the door - we've never shut the lounge door on them before.

Good to hear it's working out for ya!

Wow well done you! 7.30 is good considering she's used to 4.00! Put the other dogs back tonight, and remember- ignore ignore ignore!!! So happy for you!

Yeah we are SO pleased! She's really starting to respond to her name and commands too!

Aaa bless her!

All three dogs in the same room last night (Star in her crate) and we slept till 8AM!!!!! At last! haha.
Managed to catch Commando Dog in action - didnt fall down the slope this time and it looks like she's humping the grass!

Oops. Forgot to attach the video!

Thought you could use photobucket videos. Now using youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/my_videos?pi=0&ps=20&sf=added&sa=0&sq=&dm=1

I'm so pleased your problem is all sorted now!